Blogger Code of Ethics?

By: Lowell
Published On: 4/9/2007 5:06:20 PM

Waldo Jaquith writes about new efforts to establish and "an internet-wide blogger code of conduct."  I generally agree with Waldo when he says that "[s]omething about the internet and anonymity reveal people's inner dickheads," but honestly I haven't seen much of that here at Raising Kaine. Also, I wouldn't want to stifle free discussion and debate. What do you think?  Please treat this as an open thread on the issue of a "blogger code of ethics."

Comments



I usually stop posting (Pain - 4/9/2007 5:12:06 PM)
when I encounter the dickhead.  Some people can't understand that written text is very difficult to understand, in terms of the use of jokes and sarcasm, particularly.  This one individual I tried to engage was just so condescending and nasty that I thought my time would be better spent beating my head against the sharp corner of my file cabinet. 

Some people think they are being funny and clever, not realizing that they are the only one who gets their joke, adn the rest of us just think they are a tool.



Hmmmmm... (phriendlyjaime - 4/9/2007 5:14:08 PM)
Considering I have been called at my job and threatened by an anon psycho, had anon comments left on my blog that list my actual address AND make/color of car, AND the fact that once an anon comment left on a REALLY old post (think yay Jim Webb post, but well after New Years) just simply stated my home phone number...yeah, I am all for a code of ethics.  I mean, I really am not that threatening.  I don't know why some people have to take things so far.


Good point (Pain - 4/9/2007 5:17:08 PM)
Which is why I don't let my identity be known, not that I troll looking to start a fight.  I feel sorry for the folks who don't really have that luxury.


Ditto (KathyinBlacksburg - 4/9/2007 5:24:03 PM)
I had an online stalker too.  And this person was so obsessed he wrote 11 articles on his blog attacking me personally.  He attacked my character, patriotism, sanity, intelligence, etc.  If I weren't already retired, it probably would have been an issue.  The Ditto-heads and O'Liellies make it impossible to use a full name (though many who blog and read RK know who I am).  And so I say that Waldo is falling for their tricks.  He should ask what are their reasons for wanting everyone out there.  I don't think the reason is ethics, but rather than manipulation of it. 


I must add (KathyinBlacksburg - 4/9/2007 5:35:22 PM)
Ethical "codes" are all well and good.  They establish norms.  But they are not ironclad.  Those who pull the kind of things outlined in this NY Times article wouldn't subscribe to or live by an ethical code anyway.

Also, it's so interesting that the NY Times, and other papers,  are trying to police blogs when their own houses aren't in order.  If the media did their jobs, blogs wouldn't even be necessary.  And few would even bother.

There are some really rotten things on the internet -- and a lot of good things.  Trying to suggest that all bloggers are like the worst of the worst is kinda like suggesting the writer of the article is just like Judith Miller or Armstrong Williams.

So, while I think an ethical code is good, and I'd generally support it, I don't think compelling everyone to use their full name online is something that should be required.  There are too many bullies. 

But in case of something really outrageous, the perpetrators can be identified anyway.

PS Have they found the person who posted a notice online (Craig's list) and told people to empty out a house?  The house wasn't his (or hers).  The police are handling that one, as well they should.



In the beginning (phriendlyjaime - 4/9/2007 5:25:50 PM)
I thought maybe I should go anon.  But then I figured, gosh, it's really a small world out here in VA blogging/politics, and to be honest, every.  single.  TIME.  I have met someone at a political shindig and said, "My name is Jaime", they have IMMEDIATELY called me out as "blogger phriendlyjaime".  So, it was just a matter of time before I was NOT anon anymore.  And really...they like to think they have some sort of power, but they just don't.  And like I said, if their life is so empty that they need to call other bloggers and giggle about bloggers they disagree with and plot to get them fired...I feel really sorry for them.


What is a blogger? (Glant - 4/9/2007 5:28:28 PM)
Is there a difference between someone like Lowell who puts in time, research, etc and posts substantive material and someone like me who usually posts short comments?  Would both be covered by the Code (I think if one is then both should be).

But I am afraid of a code that is too rigorous.  How does the code differentiate from a post that says "You're wrong because a,b,c" (where a, b and c are facts) from a post that says "you're wrong because you are stupid?"  And how will you separate insult from satire?

Who will police the Code?

I have posted for 15 years to a private site of people from all across the US.  In that time, I have learned that (to paraphrase Lincoln) some people are worth reading all the time, some are worth reading some of the time, and some are worth reading none of the time.

Judicious use of the mouse and scroll buttons are probably more useful than a Code.



Good questions.; (Lowell - 4/9/2007 5:38:59 PM)
Does anyone have any answers?


"Judicious use of the mouse and scroll buttons are probably more useful than a Code." (PM - 4/9/2007 5:52:44 PM)
I agree with the previous commenter's observation. 

And I think Lowell has kicked off a few people -- quite justifiably -- who were continually abusive.  It's usually a pretty clear cut case, in my view.

I am very loathe to place any restrictions on expression, from exotic dancers to flag burners to avant garde artists who try to shock the conscience.

As to the commenters who have little to say other than abuse -- I just stop reading them.

That said -- this site needs more exotic dancers.



We've booted like 4 or 5 people (Lowell - 4/9/2007 6:05:50 PM)
in almost 2 1/2 years.  I think I let one of them back, actually, so maybe it's only 3 or 4.  Anyway, if there's a lack of exotic dancers here, it's not because of a particularly onerous banning policy...


(Ghost of A.L. Philpott - 4/9/2007 5:38:19 PM)
Good luck getting the ODBA on board...


My guess is that there would be some there (Lowell - 4/9/2007 5:39:54 PM)
who would like a "blogger code of ethics," and some who wouldn't. Same thing on the Democratic side of the blogging aisle.


TY n/t (novamiddleman - 4/9/2007 11:05:10 PM)


ODBA? (PM - 4/9/2007 7:53:43 PM)

Ornery Demented Brainless Activists?



humm (novamiddleman - 4/9/2007 11:05:41 PM)
I think we need a battle of ideas pm


simplify the code add 1 more (Shawn - 4/9/2007 6:00:07 PM)
I like to keep things simple:

1. We take responsibility for our own words and reserve the right to restrict comments on our blog that do not conform to basic civility standards.

2. We won't say anything online that we wouldn't say in person.

3. If tensions escalate, we will connect privately before we respond publicly.

4. When we believe someone is unfairly attacking another, we take action.

5. We do not allow anonymous comments.

6. We ignore the trolls. 

7. We encourage blog hosts to enforce more vigorously their terms of service. 

###8. Bought-and-paid-for bloggers will be designated with who is paying them in all their postings.###



One problem with #5... (Lowell - 4/9/2007 6:07:15 PM)
...is that it will discourage comments.  On the plus side, it will discourage "people's inner dickheads," as Waldo so eloquently puts it. :)


I used to be totally against (Pain - 4/9/2007 7:41:53 PM)
doing away with anonymous posts.  I have moderated various forums on the internet for going on 8 years, and I was never in favor of making people register a username.  I've changed my mind in the past few years.

I'm still sort of split on the issue, but on sites such as this I don't think there are a huge number of people who would just drop by to make one post and never return.  That might the case on a site where you might want to ask a technical question, for example, and once answered you wouldn't need to return.  On this type of site, I don't think that applies.

On top of that, people are getting more and more tech and internet savvy every day, and registering a user name on the internet isn't difficult to do.  With all that said, I can say with certainty that is does reduce the amount of trolling from "anonymous" users.



Blogger code of ethics? (Kenton - 4/9/2007 6:19:33 PM)
Wow, pajama pundits, look at yourselves in the mirror! Who said we needed a written code of ethics? All you need to know:

1. Don't be stupid.
2. See Rule 1.



Hahahahaha, nice. (phriendlyjaime - 4/9/2007 6:22:19 PM)
I really find it hard to believe you are so young.  You are certainly wise beyond your years, Kenton.


I like the phrase "pajama pundits" (PM - 4/9/2007 7:57:13 PM)
In fact, I plan on stealing it.


He already did... (Detcord - 4/9/2007 11:11:09 PM)
http://pajamapundits...


This "code" doesn't work on football boards... (Detcord - 4/9/2007 7:27:23 PM)
...like the ones Rivals runs for the University of Virginia.  The board moniotrs use their power to censor and ban all comments that don't put Al Groh and his program in a positive light.  There's reall no difference between the garbage they put out on that board and the Nazi propoganda mechanisms because alternative voices or viewpoints are immediately shut down.  In all fairness, I don't know why the Virginia tech boards are so much more intellectually honest and open.  Difference between winning and losing I suppose?

The point is, when does the "Code of ethics" pervert itself into content control?



Voluntary code, yes (Kindler - 4/9/2007 8:41:05 PM)
Voluntary codes of ethics are of value.  The media, for example, would be even worse than it is now if journalists didn't have a general code of ethics. 

I do agree with the use of a consistent screen name -- there are anonymous posters on NLS who leave some really nasty stuff.  But I don't believe that bloggers should be forced to publicly reveal their real names.  There are vindictive public figures out there (Tom Davis is known for that), and let's face it, sometimes you do need a little protection from them.



Yes to a Code of Ethics, No to Running Off Writers Who Post Anonymously (AnonymousIsAWoman - 4/9/2007 8:58:32 PM)
I am in favor of a voluntary code of ethics that encourages respect for others, even those across the aisle with whom we don't agree.  Also a code of honor that encourages us to be honest, to not play fast and loose with facts, to be logical rather than inflammatory, and to own our blog sites.  It is not censorship to delete those who flame others, who knowingly spread lies, and who attack and slander others.  Most blogs have comment moderation.  Most newspapers and newsmagazines have editorial policies.  And we can be held responsible for libel and slander in a court of law if we don't use our ability to delete some comments.

On the other hand, no I don't support automatically banning somebody for wanting to be anonymous.  Lately, newspapers have instituted policies of always publishing letter writers' names but I remember, not so long ago, when it was possible to write a letter to the editor and to sign yourself "Name Witheld."  Editors recognized that there were legitimate concerns, including fear of reprisals, that caused people to want to remain anonynmous.  The paper required the letter writer to sign his letter so that the paper's editors could check it out and make sure the letter was legitimate.  But people could and did ask to have their identities withheld. 

Also, many fine writers have written under pseudonyms and pen names.  This includes George Sand and Isek Dinassen, among others. And in a different age, anonymous truly was often a woman, when it was considered scandalous for women to express themselves or show they had a brain publicly.

While times have changed, there are situations where it is in fact legitimate to post under a an assumed name or simply anonymously.

And does it really matter if somebody is rude, inflammatory and untruthful even  if that person uses his or her real name?

I would gladly subscribe to a code of ethics that encouraged better behavior, not one that scared off valuable and talented writers who are not in a position to reveal themselves.

Karen Duncan
posting as AIAW



Totally agree (novamiddleman - 4/9/2007 11:06:26 PM)
Matt L_________



I understand that anonymous (Pain - 4/10/2007 7:20:47 AM)
posting is when you don't have to register on the forum to make a comment, but can post as 'anonymous'.  Requiring one to register on a forum doesn't mean they still aren't anonymous, they just aren't known by their real name.  If I misunderstand, forgive me, and I too would not be in favor of having to reveal ones identity.

You may then question, well, what is the difference?  It's a very subtle difference, but it still helps a lot in keeping trolling down.  If people have to use one username, that goes a long way in keeping at least a small amount of manners in their posting, for most people anyway.  It doesn't always work that way, but it often does. Probably helps more in reducing/eliminating the 'drive by' attacks, but you'll still get the trolls coming in to set up camp and cause trouble.



Exactly right. (Lowell - 4/10/2007 8:29:29 AM)
People have to register at RK in order to post comments or diaries.  That's at least a slightly higher threshold than completely anonymous commenting...


Code of Ethics (Kathy Gerber - 4/9/2007 11:59:05 PM)
Scoble's blogging abstention was a powerful statement, and that's the kind of thing that helps set cultural norms from the bottom up.

Lowell, with soapblox you have the ratings system in place along with enough users, so even if you were to encounter similar problems, there's a bandaid in the very short term, and other mechanisms to follow up with. And if things were to get out of control, couldn't you vet new accounts?

If you subscribe to this code - or something like it - and feature a badge, what will change? Who benefits?  I'd like to see the responses in the tech blogosphere if someone like Bill Gates instead of O'Reilly originated this code of conduct.



Blogging like Vaudeville theater. (Bernie Quigley - 4/10/2007 6:13:35 AM)
What I like about blogging is that it is like Vaudeville - in the Hitchcock movie "39 Steps" at the beginning a professor gives a speech as they did in Vaudeville, and people call him everything and ask him how to cure sheep. I like that in blogging - I am called everything.  One of the problems in blogging is people using made up names - people become disturbed doing that because they identify with an "avatar" - that is, a public persona that is a witch rather than the person they are (and much of the foulness on-line comes from that - people vent their "dark side."). It is best to stick to your name and your beliefs and ideas and take the hit: not only does it give strength to the idea, but it builds character. I participate on a psychological forum in Zurich and everyone has to use her or his own name. If you happen to be famous or cannot be identified for other reasons, you use a conventional screen like "Dave" or "Rob." Projecting on to an "avatar' causes personality damage.


I take the opposite view in terms of privacy (relawson - 4/10/2007 8:53:08 PM)
I actually wish more people would not post anonymously.  I want a blog that required people to use their true identity and verified who they said they were.  People with privacy concerns could read, but not participate.

The reason is simple: anonymous people say things they would not normally say if their identity were known.  I think such a site would be taken more seriously as well.

On the stalking and other nonsense - that is a problem.  However, anyone in the public eye risks that.  Politicians don't hide their identities, and they take on enormous risk (Senator Webb isn't packing heat because it's stylish).  As a voter and citizen I am also willing to take on some risk in order to make sure that my government represents my interests.  That means revealing my identity when I post.