As reported in the Times-Dispatch:
It is idiotic for the Allen camp and Dick Wadhams to attack Webb's integrity about a question posed by a debate moderator and not by Webb himself. Webb is man enough not to discuss Allen's Jewish ancestory, but I'm tired of the flier being brought up again and again. First, that cartoon image of Miller looks just like him, chins and all! Second, Miller must not have thought too much of it after the primary ended because he soon appeared with Webb at the Democratic unity rally. Also...
As a journalist (I'm a copy editor, not a desk editor, manager or reporter), I think quoting blog posts for articles is really weak and lazy journalism, both for editorial and news writers.
Sure bloggers on sites like Kos are more liberal-leaning than most voters because they're more passionate about their idealistic beliefs and crave staying informed and up-to-date but plucking out certain bloggers' comments to prove a point is not objective reporting because most bloggers are not qualified experts (professors, for example), it is often heresay, there are trolls who are only looking for trouble and because posts are usually anonymous and impersonal, bloggers present themselves differenly in cyberspace as they would in person. As with e-mails, blog entries are often crafted answers and ideas, and not the genuine emotional and emphatic responses in interviews. Worse yet, the post's main point could be misconstrued because the person cannot defend themselves or their ideas. Plus, it's harder to verify blog posts and there's more room for plagairism on the reporter's part.
Quoting someone's blog post isn't the same as asking a typical man on the street his 2 cents. I'd say on a blog about Allen, "Allen is a dumbass who I wouldn't trust with wiping my dog's ass," but if I was asked by a reporter I'd say, "I disagree with everything he stands for and I think he's a dishonorable politician."
The only time I think it's OK to quote blogs is for a feature story on blogs or perhaps a "how blogs have changed politics" story, but never as a source for a run-of-the-mill news story. As for editorial writing, someone desparate to prove a point could go onto any blog -- liberal, conservative or otherwise -- and find what they want (this means you, Cal Thomas!).
Unfortunately, when the big boys like WaPo and NY Times start doing it, other media outlets and reporters will follow.
You bring up an important point - something to think about, but I don't know how effective rules can be in this situation.
In my diary today, I made an error (based on an error but nevertheless...) Lowell quickly pointed it out, etc. The reason I mention this is that it is a clear example of the comments functioning as steps in a collective work to get to some understanding of a matter. Their role as vehicles of self-expression is nearly nonexistent.
The paid blogger meme is very flawed. By the same reasoning Jim Webb is responsible for whatever I. Publius says.
Maybe there is also some difficulty imagining that someone who is paid by a campaign can also have independent thoughts.
Marc Fisher had the best piece I've seen on the flier issue:
Virginia Senate: Low Blows and the Hook(nose)
Here we are, less than 100 hours from Election Day in Virginia, and the big kerfluffle in the Democratic primary for U.S. Senate is about whether one campaign drew a naughty picture of the other candidate.***Obviously, the Webb folks deny any anti-Semitism, with good reason: It's a pretty big stretch to find anything anti-Jewish about the Webb flyer. The flyer is avowedly and crashingly anti-Miller, and it's a fun, populist piece, focusing on the obviously uncomfortable position Miller's lobbying work has put him in as he now tries to persuade Virginians that he's somehow a man of the people.
But anti-Semitic? First of all, until the Miller campaign started to make noise about this flyer, hardly a soul in Virginia knew that Harris Miller is Jewish. And there was no sign that anyone cared. Second, I showed the flyer to 22 Jews and not a single one saw anything remotely wrong with it. Only after I prompted them did people see the exaggerated nose, but since not a one of them knew what Miller really looks like, no one could tell whether this was a fair caricature or not. Well, it is
Quoting someone's blog post isn't the same as asking a typical man on the street his 2 cents. I'd say on a blog about Allen, "Allen is a dumbass who I wouldn't trust with wiping my dog's ass," but if I was asked by a reporter I'd say, "I disagree with everything he stands for and I think he's a dishonorable politician."
Very funny, you made my morning brighter.
As for the RTD, I have been very vocal in my distaste for them, and I have also been told by some bloggers and Richmonders what a wonderful person Tyler Witley is, and how he is so fair to everyone, and how I should watch my tone when I email or call him or any of the staff. Well, can anyone blame me or anyone else for their anger over this and previous articles? I SAW the RTD car last night parked right across the street from our rally. Yet THIS is today's Webb coverage.
Pathetic, disgusting, and sad.
Lowell FELD is the guy who started Raising Kaine back when ...Tim Kaine was running for Governor!
Can you give a cite for that fun new quote from George's mom, because just the day before he was begging everyone to grant her respect and privacy. Is she in play again?
"Virginia should sink this vessel and wash away any effort to question Senator Allen's faith or heritage."...did you need to go take a shower after doing that steno work?
I don't see anyone from Allen's opposition questioning his faith. What they are questioning is who is George Allen? The guy has more dress-ups than my neice Becky. Cowpoke, Confederate officer, tough guy hangman, football player, CCC poster boy. The list grows by the day.
Couldn't George Allen show some respect for his REAL heritage by acknowledging and gracefully accepting his Jewish past - before it was brought up in public? How about a real story Jeff? How about something that would catapult you into the range of merely acceptable - George Allen has known for a long time that his folk were Jewish. He's lying. You are his Tool of Deceit.
Tell you what, call this guy I know - he's a real reporter with stuff like...skills. Name is Bob Gibson, writes for the Daily Progress up in Charlottesville. Make sure you use the proper address - he's Mr. Gibson to you, squirt. Ask him about George Allen and George Allen's problem with his Jewishness. George Allen is an embarrassment to the Tribe. You are embarrassment to your trade.
Best,
Mr. Bubby.
NICE JOB !!!!!!
TPM Cafe says today:
So the Midterm Roundup is honestly a bit confused. George Allen says in a statement released Tuesday on his website, “I was raised as a Christian and my mother was raised as a Christian.” But then WaPo reports that Henrietta “Etty” Allen told her son “that she had been raised as a Jew in Tunisia before moving to the United States.” And she told him this during “a conversation across the dining room table in late August.” Now it’s understandable that Allen was trying to honor his mother’s wishes of keeping her religion a secret. But now that it has come out, how long will an obvious lie be left sitting there on Allen’s website? Or is it not such an obvious lie? Is the Roundup missing something?
What's the "obvious lie" he's talking about? (I mean besides the one Wonkette talked about yesterday, that George's mother was anti-religion. http://www.wonkette.... )
Ol'George is dressing her up in prudish Presbyterian frocks, when in fact she's much more. I think she should take him to the woodshed. Hey George, stick to your own fantasies.
She was irreverent. She sounds funny as hell:
“Washingtonians think their town resembles Paris,” she once scoffed. “If Paris passed gas, you’d have Washington.”
I think Washington DC is a nice looking city, but you have to admit it pales to Paris.
BTW, somehow I don't think she really used the phrase "passed gas."
In short, Allen's mother told him (Allen) in late August that she had a Jewish upbringing. Allen contradicted that in the debate on Monday, and the Allen campaign staff also contradicted that in its Tuesday statement.
The Allen campaign is using the charge of anti-Semitism to throw up a smoke screen, and to hide their lies and contradictions of this week. We shouldn't let them get away with it, and we need to put pressure on the news media so they report this all accurately and completely.
Get it done.
I am incredibly offended here. Wadhams has accused every Democratic Blogger who has openly supported Jim Webb of being anti-Semitic. I dare somebody from the Allen Campaign to say that to my face.
I'm pissed as hell. I'm not letting this charge go. I promise you, I'm going to make Dick Wad sorry he ever decided to get into politics.
Allen endorsed the CCC in 1996, when he was photographed with three CCC leaders. That's detailed in the recent "Nation" story and photograph ("Beyond Macaca: The Photograph That Haunts George Allen), which is here.
The CCC is anti-Semitic. See their Statement of Principles (Manifest), which is here. The first principle of the Statement says this: "We believe the United States is a Christian country."
The Allen campaign charge is standard GOP tactics. Take the ugly truth about yourself, and accuse your opponent of that.
Just today they're telling the press that
* Here in Virginia, Jews are being painted antisemites.
* Democrats are being called the Klan.
* And up in Minnesota they're using racial slurs
And in each case the transparent attack is being printed as NEWS!!!
How can Webb supporters respond appropriately? My thoughts are:
1)Stick with the campaign issues- Allen is bailing a leaky
boat by sticking with a policy platform that has failed,
so they'd be happy to shift public focus to a
manufactured conspiracy theory that they can control.
Allen will say he wants to "return to the issues", but
the campaign will exploit the notion of victimhood-
ridiculous as it is- to the Nth degree, since dealing
with unquantifiable notions that play on fear is their
stock in trade.
2)Keep honest.
3)Hold reporters accountable to report unbiased truth.
If conspiracy theorists have no one to engage in dialogue, they wind up just talking to themselves. Sometimes you can spot them on the street, talking to themselves with sun glinting off their tinfoil hats. The Allen campaign is like that now.
But in Allen's case, there may be more going on here: Seen in the context of Allen's problems with the Confederate flag, the noose and macaca, there are legitimate questions to ask about his attitudes toward the past and toward people not like him. No one would argue that his approach on these issues is a sensitive and thoughtful one.
***Marc Fisher: Well, the noose was hanging in Allen's law office. Not exactly a childhood indiscretion.
***Marc Fisher: I would never have picked George Allen out of a lineup as Jewish. And I've never met his mother, but colleagues who knew her well from the era when her husband was coach of the Redskins say that even three decades ago, they thought of Etty Allen as Jewish and often talked among themselves about whether that was the case.
_______________________
Kolboynik, Maine: Marc:
If Allen didn't know he was Jewish until his mom told him recently, then why did he insist on a retraction from Bob Gibson of the Charlottesville Daily Progress when Gibson published information some time ago about Allen's Jewish roots?
Marc Fisher: Two possible explanations: He genuinely didn't know and thought the very idea was so weird that it somehow ticked him off. Or he either knew or suspected as much and somehow felt it would hurt his political career. I hope it's the former, but the latter seems more plausible.
***
Marc Fisher: The contrast between Allen's joking about how he had a ham sandwich this week and, say, Wes Clark's speeches about the five generations of rabbis in his family or Albright's writing a book looking back into her family's Jewish past is pretty stark and pretty telling.
19th and L NW, Washington, D.C.: The Allen candidacy: It's not just trying to square the ethnic heritage of George Allen with the Confederate flag/noose props that makes him an oddball.
The fact is, the guy grew up rich in Southern California and Chicago--he was a full grown man before he arrived in Virginia. His embrace of all this good ol' boy stuff, given his geographic and ethnic background is just plain bizarre.
Then there's the little fact of those smiling photos taken with members of the Council of Concerned Citizens, the cleaned up name of the White Citizens Council of the 1960s.
Marc Fisher: Also troubling.
***
Washington D.C.: In regards to the Maccacawitz fiasco, many have noted that a candidate's religion shouldn't play any role in an election. It's also important to note that it's the Republican party that has made such a big deal of religion in recent years. Now it's come back to bite them on the butt and they can't handle it. Too bad. Live by the sword, die by the sword.
Marc Fisher: There is that. Lots of that.
***
Marc Fisher: Yes, Allen's odd reactions are really a more interesting aspect of this than the Jewish heritage story per se. My initial reaction was to doubt that anyone could have such a fascinating background and not know it, but I've heard from lots of folks like you who grew up with such essential pieces of their family's past hidden, so I stand happily corrected on that impression. But Allen's instinctive decision to react derisively to the question and then mockingly to his newfound Jewish roots raises many questions indeed.
***
Alexandria, Va.: Normally I wouldn't give a hang about Allen's religion, but the story of the revelation of his Jewish ancestry is both off-putting and sad. I can't imagine his mother was afraid of the same kind of persecution her father experienced -- but she was certainly afraid of social rejection, and for good reason. In order to marry, and in order to protect her husband's career, and perhaps later in order to protect her son's career, she had to conceal her heritage as a shameful secret. What does this say about America, really, as a land of opportunity and freedom for all? I would respect the Allens more if they had courageously rejected the unfair stigmas of the past and openly joined the diverse and tolerant society they claim to celebrate.
Marc Fisher: Or if he now openly and honestly engaged on exactly the issues you just raised.
In advance, thanks!
Full disclosure: Fisher did say one negative thing about the Webb campaign: it shouldn't use "Felix" anymore.
(But then if we stop, will Wadhams say we're refusing to honor Allen's heritage? LOL)
So, no more Felix.
There was an anonymous blog quote that the RTD used during the primary that I thought was a questionable exercise in professional journalism.
I agree with your statement that blog post aren't exactly the same as statements by a man or woman on the street--in terms of relevance though there are similiarities. It's also way to easy to pick out statements that are simply salacious and not representative.
In the case of statements by paid bloggers, I think these are fair game, but judicious judgement should be used to make sure that the quotations are used in proper context.
I also wouldn't give these quotations the same amount of weight as those made by an official campaign spokesperson--even those statements are simply a stop-gap. Ideally the focus should be on the candidates own words and positions.