Debate Open Thread: The Town Hall is McCain's Favorite Format...

By: Lowell
Published On: 10/7/2008 8:56:06 PM

Tonight is probably John McCain's best shot in the debates, given that the town hall format is supposed to be his strong suit.  We'll see.  Here is what Hotline has to say about tonight, and I agree:

...McCain has a critical task, responsibility even, this evening. He must show voters that he has an understanding of the economic doldrums gripping the nation. He must present a cogent explanation for the Fannie and Freddie debacle. He must illustrate an ability to be decent, kind-hearted, relatable, frank, thoughtful. In short, he must summon himself. Circa 2000.

How convincingly he does that could determine the outcome of this election. No doubt that negative campaigning is effective, especially in the waning days of a contest. But in times of true crisis -- the nation is contending with two battles, one financial, one military -- voters look for leadership and decency, not just experience. Four weeks to go. McCain wouldn't want to wake up Nov. 5 to find that he October surprised himself out of his last shot at the White House.

Enjoy the debate, use this as an open thread, and GO BARACK!!!

UPDATE: Also, check  this out. Wow.


Comments



Here we go... (Lowell - 10/7/2008 9:03:29 PM)
Tom Brokaw in charge.  Only town hall format debate.  Audience of uncommitted voters.  Questions come from audience and online submissions.  Domestic and foreign policy.  Each candidate has 2 minutes to respond, 1 minute followup.  Candidates come on, shake hands, John McCain actually looks at Barack Obama (amazing!).  


I'm not thrilled about Brokaw (Josh - 10/7/2008 9:04:59 PM)
He's totally in the McCain camp... I wonder if he can be fair.


Help for mortgage holders (homeowners) (KathyinBlacksburg - 10/7/2008 9:09:07 PM)
McC says it's not Obama's proposal.  Actually he swiped pat of Barack effort to put help for homeowners into the effort.


Notepad (IBelieveInHenryHowell - 10/7/2008 9:09:17 PM)
When McCain walked into the room he reminded me a kid in a class who is trying to write down all the things they are afraid they are going to forget.


He'd use Warren Buffet (KathyinBlacksburg - 10/7/2008 9:10:17 PM)
Then why is he relying on Phil Gramm?

P/S./ We are not his friends.  I am sick of him saying "my friends."  Very cheesy.

"McC complains about Cronyism.  BWAAHAHAHAH  He helped invetn it./



what an asshole... (Josh - 10/7/2008 9:11:19 PM)
Brokaw:  who are you thinking of for Treasury Secretary?
McCain:  not you, Tom.


Re the "wow" (KathyinBlacksburg - 10/7/2008 9:11:28 PM)
Olbermann dealt with it tonight on Countdown.


Financial meltdown/economy (Lowell - 10/7/2008 9:11:28 PM)
Allen Shaeffer:  Solution for older Americans.

Obama:  Thanks to Allen for the question, to Belmont, to Tom Brokaw. We are in worst financial crisis since Great Depression. A lot of you are worried.  This is final verdict on failed econ. policies of last 8 years, supported by John McCain. It hasn't worked out, now we have to take decisive action. Rescue package, need to make sure that works properly.  Crack down on CEO's.  Oversight.  We just found out that AIG went on a $400,000 junket.  Treasury should demand that money back and exec's should be fired.  Middle class needs rescue package.  Long term need to fix health care system, energy system that puts burden on families, middle class.

McCain: Thanks.  Good to be with you at a town hall meeting, Sen. Obama. Americans are angry, upset, a little fearful, it's our job to fix the problem.  Energy independence.  Keep America's taxes low.  Let's not raise taxes on anybody.  Stop spending spree in washington.  Package of reforms leading to prosperity, peace in world. Do something about home values.  I would order Sec. Treasury to buy up bad mortgages.  Until we stabilize home values, we'll never turn around and start creating jobs.  I know how to do that my friends, get America working again.

"Not you, Tom."

"That's a tough question." First criterion is that Americans identify with them.  Warren Buffett is a possibility.  Meg Whitman, CEO of EBay. Somebody who inspires trust and confidence.  problem today to a large extent is trust and confidence because of greed on Wall Street, cronyism in Washington, DC.

Obama - Warren Buffett would be good choice, and I'm pleased to have his support.  We've got to help middle class, not just those at top.  We have fundamental disagreements. Fundamentals of economy are not sound.  Middle class tax cut to 95% of working Americans.  



TV (IBelieveInHenryHowell - 10/7/2008 9:11:53 PM)
Who's watching this where? I'm on CNN watching the squiggly lines at the bottom.


McShame says Barack and his "friends" (KathyinBlacksburg - 10/7/2008 9:13:37 PM)
caused Fannie and Freddie.  Here we go (same old lying sack McShame.  

Barack better put Gramm into the mix.



out of the ballpark (Josh - 10/7/2008 9:16:43 PM)
Obama's retort on fannie freddie was fantastic.


Oliver Clark (Lowell - 10/7/2008 9:18:34 PM)
Bailout package.

McCain:  I believe that it's rescue.  Main Street paid a heavy price.  I suspended my campaign, went back to washington to protect taxpayer.  Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, they're the ones that, with the encouragement of Sen. Obama and his cronies, they went out and made risky loans.  Some of us stood up and said, we have to enact legislation and fix this.  Meanwhile, Dem's in Senate defended what fannie and Freddie were doing.  Sen. Obama was second highest recipient of Fannie and Freddie money in history.  Stabilize markets, shore up institutions, but it's not enough. We have to stabilize home values.  Fannie and Freddie were the match that started this forest fire. Some of us stood up against this, others took a hike.

Obama;  Right now credit markets frozen up.  Businesses can't get loans, that means they can't make payroll.  Imagine a million companies across the country dealing with this. We shouldn't have been there in the first place. I need to correct Sen.  McCain's history. Biggest problem was deregulation.  McCain bragged that he's a deregulator.  I warned about this.  Nobody did anything about it.  Sen. McCain said we should keep on deregulating. With respect to Fannie Mae, what McCain didn't mention is that it wasn't his bill and it wasn't passed.  You're not interested in politicians pointing fingers. This is not end of process, this is beginning, we need to work with homeowners to keep them in their homes.  Not simply bail out banks on Wall Street.

Obama;  I am confident about the American economy, but we need leadership from Washington. We have archaic 20th century regulatory system for 21st century financial markets. Help ordinary families stay in their homes, pay their bills, deal with health care and energy, change process in washington

McCain: Depends on what we do.  If we stabilize housing market, buy up bad loans. Get rid of cronyism and special interests in Washington.  Letter we wrote, Sen. Obama's name was not on that letter. American workers are best in world.  They are innocent bystanders...we can do it.



I'm watching CNN, too... (Josh - 10/7/2008 9:20:49 PM)
Those squiggly lines are through the roof for Obama.


Teresa Finch (Lowell - 10/7/2008 9:23:52 PM)
How can we trust either of you with our money when both parties got us into this crisis?

Obama: I understand your frustration and cynicism.  You're right, there's a lot of blame to go around. Important to remember, when Bush came into office, we had surpluses, now we have huge deficit.  Debt has almost doubled.  While it's true that nobody's completely innocent, but over last 8 years, biggest increases in debt in our history. Sen. McCain voted for 4 of 5 George Bush budgets.  I'll spend money on key issues we have to work on - health care, energy (can't borrow from China and send money to Saudi Arabia), also need to make spending cuts. I'm cutting more than I'm spending. Priorities that are working for you, have to put an end to lobbyists and special interests.

McCain: I can see why you feel cynicism and mistrust.  Washington is broken.  I've been a reformer, reached across aisle - Feingold, Lieberman.  The situation today cries out for bipartisanship.  We need to reform.  Look at records not just rhetoric.  Obama's never taken on his leadership.  Obama has the most liberal, big-spending record in Senate.  He's proposing $860 billion in new spending. He voted for every increase in spending while we were working to eliminate pork barrel earmarks.  Do we need to spend that kind of money.  Look at his proposals and mine.  Get middle income workers working again.  Energy independence.  Drill offshore, nuclear power, I know how to fix this economy and eliminate dependence on foreign oil.



Flat lining (IBelieveInHenryHowell - 10/7/2008 9:23:52 PM)
I haven't seen much movement when McCain is reciting his talking points.


Brokaw: highest priorities? (Lowell - 10/7/2008 9:28:14 PM)
McCain: Work on all three at once.  Reform entitlement programs.  We are not going to be able to provide same benefits that present day retirees get.  I have clear record of reaching across aisle - Lieberman, Feingold, Ted Kennedy. All of the above on energy.  Clean coal, nuclear.  We can take on this mission and overcome it.  Everyone's struggling on health care. All three are compelling.

Obama: We're going to have to prioritize just like a family. Have to deal with energy today.  That's a strain on family budget and bad for national security.  Countries like Russia, Venezuela, Iran are benefiting. In 10 years, we should be free of Middle Eastern oil.  JFK said we're going to moon in 10 years. That's priority #1.  Health care is priority #2.  Bad for families and makes businesses less competitive.  #3 is education.  Look at our records. I'll go line by line through federal budget and eliminate programs that don't work.  McCain proposed $300 billion tax cut to big corporations including big oil companies, that's money out of system. Need to prioritize...



Images (GeorgetownStudent - 10/7/2008 9:28:38 PM)
Obama looks confident and comforting. McCain looks so old and scary. He can't even properly walk.  


dottering (Josh - 10/7/2008 9:29:59 PM)
Watching McCain teeter around that stage makes me wish someone would get him a walker.


McCain will eliminate even good projects. (KathyinBlacksburg - 10/7/2008 9:30:07 PM)
Except for defense and vet. affairs spending freeze.  McC never votes for Vet bill anyway.


Has anyone else noticed (IBelieveInHenryHowell - 10/7/2008 9:30:09 PM)
the facial tick on McCain's left side of his face?


I mean vet bills (KathyinBlacksburg - 10/7/2008 9:30:25 PM)


This is good--Barack urging conservation (KathyinBlacksburg - 10/7/2008 9:32:44 PM)


Casting it in terms of service to country is grat. (KathyinBlacksburg - 10/7/2008 9:33:06 PM)


Internet question - Fiora from chicago (Lowell - 10/7/2008 9:33:20 PM)
Sacrifices.

McCain: Some programs we may have to eliminate.  Examine every agency and every bureaucracy and eliminate those that aren't working. Defense spending. Eliminate earmarks.  Same scrutiny that all projects undergo.  Spending freeze except for defense, veterans, and some other vital programs.  Establish priorities with full transparency, not in middle of night.  We are Americans, we can work together and solve these problems, don't have to wait, get 'em all done.

Obama:  A lot of you remember tragedy of 9/11, how all of the country was ready to come together and make enormous changes.  President Bush did some smart things at outset, but opportunity that was missed, Bush said go shopping.  That wasn't call to service that the American people were looking for.  Kind of leadership that will tackle problems both in government and outside government.  We all need to think about how we use energy.  Tell oil companies to use 'em or lose 'em.  Develop clean coal technology, safe nuclear power.  Incentives for people to buy fuel efficient car made here in America, weatherize home, effort from each and every one of us. Double Peace Corps.  Create Volunteer Corps across country.  Military families and troops shouldn't be only ones bearing burden.



I cannot type. Maybe I should give it up. (KathyinBlacksburg - 10/7/2008 9:33:36 PM)


McCain making some points... no knockouts... (Josh - 10/7/2008 9:34:04 PM)
nothing even close.

Half way through this, I've seen nothing to change the game, except to push more independents and moderates towards Obama.



What I Wonder Is... (norman swingvoter - 10/7/2008 9:36:23 PM)
What is mccain writing notes on. He has been scribbling since the first minute.  I have decided to watch this debate.  Switching between CNN and Bloomberg.


McCain is a loser (Josh - 10/7/2008 9:36:42 PM)
he sounds snide in his hoover comparison and "nailing jello"

His "Obama's secret" stuff sounds bizarre and paranoid.



Comparing Barack to Hoover????? (KathyinBlacksburg - 10/7/2008 9:36:59 PM)
????? McC says if people lose their jobs their taxes will be increased.  Zero income is not taxed.  WTF?


Obama better break McCain's spine on HealthCare (Josh - 10/7/2008 9:37:38 PM)
go...


Brokaw: Too much debt, easy credit. (Lowell - 10/7/2008 9:37:49 PM)
Obama;  It starts with Washington.  We need to show we have good habits.  It means looking at both spending and revenue sides.  McCain has been talking tough about earmarks.  It's not sharing a burden to give tax cuts to CEO's while asking teacher to tighten her belt.  It's important for president to set a tone - all of us need to contribute.  Across the board freeze is using a hatchet, not a scalpel.

McCain: Nailing Obama's tax proposals is like nailing jello to wall.  He wants to raise taxes.  Last president to do that was Herbert Hoover, who practiced protectionism as well.  We've lost jobs, Obama's secret that you don't know is that his tax increases will hit small business revenue, won't be able to hire. I've got some news, Sen. Obama, the news is bad.  I am not in favor of tax cuts for wealthy, I am in favor of leaving tax rates alone.  I want to give tax credits for health care, not mandates. Let's not raise anybody's taxes.  



Holy crap (KathyinBlacksburg - 10/7/2008 9:38:09 PM)
Brokaw wouldn't even let Obama correct the misrepresentation by McC.


What the hell? (GeorgetownStudent - 10/7/2008 9:38:46 PM)
Tom Brokaw is such a f-ing bitch. Why the hell didn't he allow Obama to respond to McCain's outright lies... ughh...  


"My friends" (GeorgetownStudent - 10/7/2008 9:41:36 PM)
No one in their right mind would be friends with that senile man.


deceiving about bipartisan solutions for Soc Sec (KathyinBlacksburg - 10/7/2008 9:41:57 PM)
But he plans to privatize it (by another name).  Dems won't agree with that.


Too many lobbyists, says McC (KathyinBlacksburg - 10/7/2008 9:42:43 PM)
The man has 177 lobbyists working on his campaign (83 from banking and Wall St.)


Reform Social Security? (Lowell - 10/7/2008 9:42:59 PM)
Obama:  We're going to have to take on entitlements quickly.  Straight Talk Express lost a wheel onthat one. I want to provide a tax cut for 95% of Americans.  If you make less than 1/4 million a year, not a single dime of tax increase. Under that, your taxes will go down. Vast majority of small businesses will get tax cut, plus tax credits to buy health insurance for workers. McCain wants to give $300 billion tax cut to largest corporations, CEO's on Wall Street.  That is not fair and it doesn't work. If we get tax policies right so they're good for middle class, then we'll be in position to deal with Soc. Sec. and Medicare.

McCain: I'll answer the question. It's not that hard to fix Social Security. We know what problems and fixes are.  I saw it with Ronald Reagan and Tip O'Neill. Sen. Obama has never taken on party leaders.  Medicare will be a little tougher, difficult and complex issues.  Have a commission.  Have Congress vote up or down. Sen. Obama has voted 94 times to increase your taxes or against tax cuts. Look at our record. I've fought higher taxes.  Our best days are ahead of us.



McCain: Obama won't take on his party leaders (Glant - 10/7/2008 9:44:13 PM)
Give me a break!!  If McCain was such an effective fighter against his party leaders, why is it he never got Bush to change a single policy?


If he says (IBelieveInHenryHowell - 10/7/2008 9:44:53 PM)
Liber-shits name one more time....


Zingggg!!! (Josh - 10/7/2008 9:47:18 PM)
Politicians have been talking about energy for 30 years and not doing anything about it... What McCain doesn't tell you is that he's been in Washington for 26 of them.


Ingrid Jackson (Lowell - 10/7/2008 9:47:43 PM)
Move fast on environmental issues.

McCain: Issue we may hand our children, a damaged planet.  I've disagreed strongly with Bush administration. We forced votes, but we lost. Best way of fixing it is nuclear power.  It's safe and it's clean and it creates hundreds of thousands of jobs.  we can do it, Sen. Obama's opposed that.  Develop clean technologies, hydrogen, hybrids, get economy going.  We're the best innovators.

Obama:  This is one of the biggest challenges of our time. This is not just a challenge, it's an opportunity.  New energy economy can be an engine like the computer, 5 million new jobs easily.  We're going to have to make an investment.  We've got to understand this is a national security issue. I favor nuclear power as one component. It is important to look at record.  Sen. McCain has been in Washington 26 years, he voted 23 times against alternative fuels.  Easy to talk about during campaign.  Sen. McCain talks a lot about drilling, but we have 3% of world's oil reserves, we use 25% of world's oil.  We can't just drill our way out of this. We have to come up with alternatives, fund innovation with private sector.



Obvious (Ingrid - 10/7/2008 9:56:25 PM)
It was so obvious that McCain is uncomfortable with people of color.  He couldn't even establish eye conctact w/Ms. Jackson.  In addition, he referred to Sen. Obama as "That one".  He deeply disrespects Sen. Obama and other people of color!


Should we fund Manhattan project on energy? (Lowell - 10/7/2008 9:49:53 PM)
McCain:  R&D is certainly appropriate.  Once it gets into productive stages, turn over to private sector.  I have fought time and again against pork barrel bills. Obama voted for Bush/Cheney bill.  Oil drilling offshore now is vital so we can bridge gap.  We've got to drill offshore now.  Look at record on nuclear.


Fundamental economics? (dsvabeachdems - 10/7/2008 9:55:25 PM)
McCain is talking about fundamental economics? No, on a tangent reagarding drilling he is discussing psychology of the markets. But, he is a typical Republican Know-nothing who is mesmerized by econoinc jargon.


What is he doing?? (GeorgetownStudent - 10/7/2008 9:51:59 PM)
Can McCain not sit still? He constantly gets up and walks around while Obama is talking.


Gerotol (IBelieveInHenryHowell - 10/7/2008 9:54:26 PM)
It's his gerotol kicking in!


That one????? (IBelieveInHenryHowell - 10/7/2008 9:53:19 PM)
What the hell does McC mean by "that one"?


He meant Sen. Obama (Ingrid - 10/7/2008 9:57:50 PM)
And he is extremely disrespectful of Sen. Obama and people of color in general.  I have experienced his type before.


Code words are alive and well (dsvabeachdems - 10/7/2008 10:00:18 PM)
in the Republican Party.


Dog whistle! (IBelieveInHenryHowell - 10/7/2008 10:02:02 PM)


Disrespectful of people in general (TurnPWBlue - 10/7/2008 10:17:03 PM)
McCain is an equally opportunity offender.  He's been talking down to Obama and everyone throughout the debate.

"Freddie and Fannie...you probably had never heard of them before this whole crisis..."



He is worse (Ingrid - 10/7/2008 10:24:07 PM)
with people of color, I am convinced...


There's my health care answer.... yeah baby (Josh - 10/7/2008 9:53:44 PM)
McCain sucks ass and Obama destroyed him.


the polls (pvogel - 10/7/2008 9:55:13 PM)
slightly off topic, but I notice on liberal blogs many ref. to the latet ploling, and on the republican blogs nary  word about the latest polling.


CNN lines are through the roof for Obama on Healthcare (Josh - 10/7/2008 9:58:51 PM)
He's taking the stage and taking the fight to McCain on this stuff 100%.  Gorgeous.


He's crushing (Pain - 10/7/2008 10:06:14 PM)

Obama is on fire tonight.  McCain sounds like he's telling bedtime stories, with his 'breathy, higher pitched voice'.  And, my friends, the rabbit ran down the garden path.


Health care as a commodity (Lowell - 10/7/2008 9:59:12 PM)
Obama: This is one of single most frequently asked isseus I get.  This is breaking family budgets. Premiums soaring. Crushing burden.  We have a moral commitment and econ. imperative to do something. If you've got health care, you can keep it if you're satisfied.  we'll work with your employer to lower cost of your premiums, invest in prevention, information technology. If you don't have health insurance, you'll be able to buy same insurance that Sen. McCain and I can buy.  He has different kind of approach; he'll tax your employer-based healthcare benefits for first time ever.  His approach is fundamentally wrong way to go. Chamber of commerce said it would lead to unraveling of health care system...

McCain:  Major challenge facing Americans.  We need to make more efficient, health records online, community health centers, walk-in clinics.  Fundamental difference between Sen. Obama and me. "Government will do this, government will do that."  Sen. Obama will fine you.  I want to give $5,000 refundable tax credits.  Can take it across state lines.  Why not?  Do the math.  We have got to give people choice and not mandate things.  

It's a responsibility - we should have available and affordable health care to every American system. I'm always nervous about government mandates, you're gonna get fined...

Obama: It should be a right.  For my mother to die of cancer at age 53, spend last year of her life arguing with insurance companies, there's something fundamentally wrong about this.  If you've got a health care plan that you like, you can keep it.  There's no mandate involved.  Small business will not have a mandate.  You have to make sure your child has health care.  McCain voted against SCHIP.  I think it's important for government to crack down on insurance companies that are cheating their customers.  State by state is a problem, insurance companies will find a state where there are no requirements and they will all set up shop there.  Fundamental difference - he believes in deregulation in every circumstance.



And look what deregulaton has done for the financial markets! (dsvabeachdems - 10/7/2008 10:02:55 PM)
n/t


Health care as a commodity (Quizzical - 10/7/2008 10:59:33 PM)
I'm curious about the question -- why use the word "commodity"?  The only explanation I can think of is that the person asking the question was wondering whether either candidate's plan would treat doctors as commodities, or in other words, take away the patient's choice as to which doctor to see.  But maybe there is a theory floating around that discusses health care as a commodity.  Anybody know?


OMG Tax my benifits WTF (humanfont - 10/7/2008 10:00:47 PM)
Did he actually say he was going to tax my benefits and if I had a gold plated health care plan I would pay more.  So basically John McCain says I shouldn't have great health care.  What an incredibly stupid idea.  


This is turning out to be a total blowout (Josh - 10/7/2008 10:04:34 PM)
McCain is getting his ass kicked.

This is gorgeous.



Phil Ellliott (Lowell - 10/7/2008 10:08:33 PM)
Mccain: Need to have strong economy to have strong military.  America is greatest force for good in history of the world.  We are peacemakers and peacekeepers.  When to go in and when not. That question can only be answered by someone with knowledge and judgment to know.  We're a nation of good.  My record and judgment is something I'm willing to stand on.  He was wrong about Iraq and the surge, Russia/Georgia, we don't have time for on the job training.

Obama: Sen. McCain suggests that I don't understand.  It's true, I don't understand how we ended up invading a country that had nothing to do with 9/11 while we let Bin Laden go.  That was Sen. Mccain's judgment, and it was the wrong judgment. That was the wrong judgment.  Enormous strain on our troops.  Enormous strain on our budget.  Sen. McCain wants to continue on same path, $10 billion a month at a time Iraq has $79 billion surplus.  We need that money in the united States. We are greatest nation on earth.  But you can't see economy decline and maintain military power.  Strain on alliances.  Sen. Mccain's and George Bush's foreign policy has not worked for America.

We may not always have national security issues at stake, but we may have moral obligation. Holocaust, Rwanda...have to strongly consider and act when genocide, ethnic cleansing is happening.  It diminishes us to stand idly by. Intervene where possibility.  We can't be everywhere all the time, need to work with allies.  Darfur, we could provide logistical support.  Need to mobilize international community and lead.

McCain: If we had done what Sen.Obama had suggested in Iraq, we would have had a wider war, Iranian influence would have increased.  Obama would have brought troops home in defeat, I'll bring them home in victory and honor.  Cool hand at the tiller, understand our limits.  We ended up as peacemakers in Somalia. I stood up to Reagan in Lebanon.  You have to temper decisions...I know those situations, I've been in them all my life.  We have to say never again to Holocaust or Rwanda, but don't make situation worse.



Now that was phenominal nonsense from McCain (dsvabeachdems - 10/7/2008 10:13:06 PM)
Peacemakers in Somalia? Wider war with whom?


McCain is being completely dominated... (Josh - 10/7/2008 10:11:55 PM)
Jeffrey Feldman just wrote:  He looks like an old boyscout who has lost his compass.

Nothing here is going to change the overall dynamic of the debate.  We're at the end of the first hour, so half of the audience is going to start tuning out.  

If there was going to be a big game changer it would have come by now.  It hasn't.

Look for individual Republicans to start running scared, and distancing themselves from the erratic McCain campaign.  Look for McCain and Palin to spin completely out of control and go from erratic to hysterically paranoid.  There will be violent assertions and there will be insane slurs.  This is the end of McCain.  

If we do the work we need to do, Obama is the next president.  McCain just lost the air war.

Obama's "we will kill bin laden" was like a giant work of art.

McCain's heroes Reagan, Teddy Roosevelt, can't save him, because he's not big enough to fill their shoes.



He met Teddy Roosevelt... :-) (Ingrid - 10/7/2008 10:13:21 PM)


Burn (humanfont - 10/7/2008 10:15:35 PM)
Bomb bomb bomb iran isn't an example of walking softly...OMG that is the burn of the month.  McCain is toast.


10 points for Obama! (Josh - 10/7/2008 10:18:11 PM)
Just for knowing the correct pronunciation of General Mckiernan's name.


Here's a fun thing... (Josh - 10/7/2008 10:19:15 PM)
Let's score Obama's performance as if he were Sarah Palin!


Holy Shit!!! (Josh - 10/7/2008 10:23:37 PM)
He just pronounced estonia correctly, and it actually is NEAR russia... just like he said.

He's killing tonight.  



Petro Dollars...? (Josh - 10/7/2008 10:24:10 PM)
He must be a genius!


He spoke in a complete sentence... (Josh - 10/7/2008 10:30:14 PM)
he said nuclear... not nuklear  

woah



Katie Hamm (Lowell - 10/7/2008 10:19:15 PM)
Pakistan/Al Qaeda.

Obama; we have difficult situation in Pakistan. In part, because we made bad decision to go into Iraq before finishing job against bin Laden.  They are stronger now than any time since 2001. We need to reverse course.  That's the central front in war on terrorism.  Gates said it began in that region and it will end there.  We have to change our policies with Pakistan.  Can't coddle a dictator who makes deals with Taliban. Expand non-military aid to Pakistan. Insist that they go after militants.  If we have Bin Laden in our sights, we will kill bin laden, we will crush Al Qaeda.

McCain:  Hero is Teddy Roosevelt - talk softly and carry a big stick.  Obama talks loudly.  When you announce this, it turns public opinion against us.  We drove Russians out of Afghanistan, then made serious mistake, washed our hands of Afghanistan.  Our relations with Pakistan are critical.  We have to get their support. Gen. Petraeus had a strategy, same fundamental strategy that succeeded in Iraq. Get support of people, get them to work with us.  Don't threaten to attack them.  

Obama: I want to be very clear.  Nobody called for invasion of Pakistan. If Pakistan is unable or unwilling to hunt down bin Laden, we should.  They are threatening to kill more Americans.  McCain sang "bomb bomb bomb Iran," called for annhilation of North Korea,"next up Baghdad," that's not speaking softly.  We were supporting a dictator in Pakistan.  We were not promoting democracy, ended up undermining.

McCain: Not true.  I understand what it's like to send Americans into harm's way. I know how to handle these crises. I'll get Osama bin Laden no matter what, no matter what, but I'm not going to telegraph my punches.  I'll act responsibly as I've done throughout my military career.

Obama:  We are going to have to make the Iraq government take more responsibility, withdraw are troops in a responsible way, put more troops in Afghanistan, our bases and outposts are now targets of Taliban attacks.  Karzai government has to do better by his people, responsive, right now it's not.

McCain: Petraeus has just taken over position of responsibility.  Same overall strategy.  Double size of afghan army, work more closely with Pakistanis.  Obama still won't admit he was wrong on strategy in Iraq.  I have confidence in Gen. Petraeus.



Afghanistan isn't going to be a surge (Quizzical - 10/7/2008 11:10:22 PM)
McCain again talked about a surge in Afghanistan.  But Gen. McKiernan doesn't want to call it a surge, because what is needed is a long term commitment.  I have to say that the brass has been speaking truth to power about Afghanistan.  But are the politicians really listening?

A "surge" implies something that is short term.  I'd hate to see a long-term escalation of combat in Afghanistan  sold to the public as a "surge."  We'll be surging there for 10 more years if we don't watch out.



Peace with honor.... (IBelieveInHenryHowell - 10/7/2008 10:20:59 PM)
Can someone find an old video of Nixon in 68? That was his whold mantra for that campaign. The same talking point from 1968....


John McCain forgot to mention... (norman swingvoter - 10/7/2008 10:22:56 PM)
that a major part of the success in calming Iraq has been that we are paying off large numbers of fighters in Iraq monthly.  Quick, someone ask if he wants to start paying off the taliban in Afghanistan and Pakistan.  


Hire them all to guard our airports! (dsvabeachdems - 10/7/2008 10:25:27 PM)
That will get inside their decision cycle for a while.


Brokaw is an Ass (Glant - 10/7/2008 10:23:54 PM)
Notice how he only criticizes Obama for taking too much time?  He lets McCain go on and on and on ...


Israel (Lowell - 10/7/2008 10:30:06 PM)
McCain:  Iran nukes, threat to entire Middle East.  Sen. Obama wants to sit down and negotiate without preconditions.  I want to impose significant tough sanctions.  Join with allies and friends in league of democracies.  we can never allow 2nd Holocaust.

Obama:  We honor your service.  We cannot allow Iran to get a nuclear weapon, it would be game changer in region.  It would threaten israel, strongest ally in region and one of strongest allies in world.  It's unacceptable.  we will never take military options off table.  Use all tools at our disposal to prevent that scenario. If we can work more effectively with other countries to tighten sanctions, reduce our energy consumption so Iran has less money, prevent Iran from important gasoline they need, change cost benefit analysis. We should have direct talks with our friends and enemies, deliver tough, direct message.  We have a better chance at better outcomes if we talk.  



Like a skipping CD (rosebudrmm - 10/7/2008 10:31:18 PM)
McCain is a broker record tonight, repeating his criticisms and (in his mind) catchy phrases. In a comparison of the first debate with tonight's, I am wondering how many sentences would match up exactly.


What don't you know... (Lowell - 10/7/2008 10:34:36 PM)
Obama: It's never challenges you expect, it's the challenges that you don't. I know i wouldn't be standing here if it weren't for the fact that this country gave me opportunity.  I came from modest means. I was able to go to best schools in country.  Pass on same American dream to next generation? Over last 8 years, we've seen that dream diminish.  We can't expect that if we do the same thing the past 8 years, we'll get a different outcome. We need fundamental change, move in new direction.

McCain: What I don't know is what's going to happen both here at home and abroad. There are challenges around the world that are new and different.  We'll be talking about countries we barely know where they are on the map.  My mother basically raised our family.  I know what it's like in dark times, to rely on others for courage, support, love.  I believe in this country.  Give me another opportunity, I'll rest on my record, we need a steady hand at the tiller, always put country first.



Wolf: McCain's Disdain for Obama (Josh - 10/7/2008 10:37:04 PM)
Anderson:  contentious... McCain openly dislikes Obama.


This was a clear win for Obama (Ron1 - 10/7/2008 10:37:46 PM)
It wasn't even close.

I actually think Brokaw over all was very fair, tried to steer the debate when it was appropriate, and generally let the two Senators speak.



I think all critizism of Brokaw is unfounded (Pain - 10/7/2008 10:43:07 PM)

I think Brokaw was fair to both men.

Obama crushed McCain.  Totally Distroyed IMO, and I try to stay neutral and would say if I though McCain won.  He didn't.  He's got owned.



Vote here: (KathyinBlacksburg - 10/7/2008 10:37:59 PM)
here


Loved The Finish.... (norman swingvoter - 10/7/2008 10:38:45 PM)
The back of mccain's head blocking the camera. :) LOL


Wouldn't shake his hand (rosebudrmm - 10/7/2008 10:38:51 PM)
McCain clapped him on the back, but when Obama offered his hand, John guided him towards Cindy and wouldn't shake!


David Gergen - (Josh - 10/7/2008 10:38:56 PM)
Flat debate.

Obama composed, and collected.  He made many arguments that connected well with women.



PBS (Lowell - 10/7/2008 10:39:48 PM)
David Brooks: Obama won.  Easy to be around, to imagine him as president.  Reasonably fluid. Adapt to changing world, more at home in times. No big surprises, nothing that would even potentially change momentum in race.

Mark Shields: Nothing happened that changed things in the race.  John McCain was tone deaf on sacrifice.  Neither one rose to challenge of leveling with American people on sacrifices required.  Thought McCain would be more aggressive, didn't feel that he was tonight.



CBS focus group. (Lowell - 10/7/2008 10:42:20 PM)
Fred: Tired of last 8 years.  Gone from uncommitted to committed for Obama. Like his approach.

Nobody else went from uncommitted to committed.



Faux (aznew - 10/7/2008 10:42:52 PM)
Brit: McCain needed a moment to change the dynamic of the race, the kind the media plays over and over. "I didn't hear one."

Fred Barnes and Bill Kristol both look constipated.

Mort - Both candidates were mainly given opportunities to repeat their talking points.

Kristol - Slamming Brokaw for dumb questions - like he's "interviewing the next secretary of HHS." Since McCain is behind, he says, it was a bigger disservice to McCain.

Nina - "We were witnessing something quite profound" - the end of free-market Republicans. She is referring to McCain's plan to take over mortgages.

I think this is a great point. Along with what is beginning to look like an Obama win, this sort of stuff will end up depressing the GOP base. In the first place, who wants to vote for a loser? The only reason is for principle.

Fred Barnes - He is ticked that Brokaw didn't just ask about all of the GOP's wedge issues - guns, same sex marriage, etc., and questions on character.



And this is why (Ron1 - 10/7/2008 10:45:09 PM)
Brit Hume, et al, should never be allowed to moderate a Presidential debate. Might as well let Sean Hannity be the arbiter of fairness at that point.


Thanks Lowell (IBelieveInHenryHowell - 10/7/2008 10:43:29 PM)
Great job again tonight. Looking forward to the next time!


Yes, Lowell, great job! n/t (aznew - 10/7/2008 10:48:19 PM)


Thanks, it was fun (Lowell - 10/7/2008 10:52:42 PM)
but my fingers are tired. :)


Thanks Lowell (norman swingvoter - 10/7/2008 10:53:14 PM)
This definitely adds an additional dimension to the debates.


Holy Moly (aznew - 10/7/2008 10:46:38 PM)
Luntz focus group, from Arlingotn, actually liked Obama better.

All will be shot to death on way out of the room. This will not due.

Luntz - Obama did better overall. Responses to health care turned the debate in Obama's favor.

Hilarious moment - Luntz says group thought McCain did better on economy. Brit challenges him, asking increduously, "They thought McCain did better on the economy?"

Luntz asks for a show hands. "Who thinks McCain did better on the economy?" About one-fifth raise their hands, and Luntz turns to the camera and says, "Okay, about half thought McCain did better."



ABC (Lowell - 10/7/2008 10:50:03 PM)
Dowd, Clarke, Brazile.

Dowd: Style points, roughly even.  Problem McCain had is did he change momentum of race. There was no game changer by John McCain. Obama didn't fumble.

Torie Clarke: McCain connected with people in hall.  Record vs. rhetoric. It wasn't enough to change game.  We're grading these guys on curves now, McCain couldn't do it.

Brazile: Obama had one homework assignment, explain to American people in simple terms the problems of Main street and wall St. Come across as commander in chief. He passed both tests.  McCain couldn't change fundamentals of race.

Gibson: McCain could never get into a rhythm.

Stephanopolous: The hall was rapt.  I don't think it played different in hall than on TV.  Dog that didn't bark - sarah Palin has brought up William Ayers, but nothing tonight.  Was that a mistake?

Dowd: It's very telling, voters don't care about that, want to focus on economy.  Doesn't work in front of town hall format.  McCain has one last chance, tonight didn't do it.

Brazile: Neither candidate talked about Dow under 10,000.

Clarke: Neither candidate showed justifiable anger.

Dowd: Neither wanted to go out on limb. American public wanted them to give the answer.



More Faux (aznew - 10/7/2008 10:53:48 PM)
Mitt is on now with Chris Wallace. Chris is deflated.

Talking about new mortgage plan.

Chris: "Can we afford it?"

Mitt: McCain recognizes we will need to stabalize home values. Really?

Chris - Was this the game changer?

Mitt - "We'll see after the night is over." Uh-oh.

Brit asking Greta what she thought, and she says, and I'm not kidding, "What really counts are the undecided voters in the swing states."



CBS instant poll (Lowell - 10/7/2008 10:56:28 PM)
of uncommitted voters.

Who won the debate: McCain 27%, Obama 39%, tie 35%
Very few minds changed of uncommitted.
Obama and McCain both improved on economy.
Understands your needs and problems: both went up.
Prepared for job?  McCain went up slightly, Obama went up from 42% to 57%.
Answered the questions?  57%-42% said yes for both Obama and McCain.



Claire McCaskill (aznew - 10/7/2008 11:00:33 PM)
on now. Obama was so great, spinning is effortless.

Weird moment with Chris Wallace talking about how cold it is at the hall and sharing body warmth with McCaskill.

The entire Faux team seems positively disoriented.

Just switched to MSNBC. Harold Ford saying there was no clear winner. What an idiot. Isn't he a Democrat?

Matthews - Obama has a wonderful smile. McCain has a "menancing" smile.

I will say this - I think the big news of the night was McCain's mortgage plan and how bent out of shape the wingers will get over that.