An uncommitted look at the field of Democrats

By: teacherken
Published On: 12/24/2007 10:56:58 AM

crossposted from Daily Kos at Lowell's request

I am uncommitted.   When I read the various candidate diaries, pro- and con-, I am at times amused, and at other times saddened.   I have no trouble with ardent, passionate support of a candidate, in fact I welcome it.   Nor do I have trouble with raising issues that might be a problem for another candidate in the general (although I do remind people that Willie Horton, albeit without his name or all the specifics, was first raised against Dukakis by the now-sainted Al Gore:  before that the Republicans did not have a hint).  

In the vast majority of cases I am neither convinced for or dissuaded from support of a candidate by what people offer.  The polling data may be interesting, but offers little meaningful information, at least for me.  And I have no interest in attempting to persuade or dissuade others.

But I do have observations, and I am not unwilling to share what I perceive.  So as we are about to take (mercifully) a hiatus, even if only a few days, from active campaigning by the principals, I thought I would offer what has struck me recently about the campaigns and the candidates.  And remember, I would support any of the top three against any conceivable Republican.  
I have been inescapably struck by what I perceive as a contradiction in the Clinton campaign.  Simply put, either the series of attacks on Obama at significant levels of the campaign were a deliberate strategy or else the campaign is unable to manage its own message even among its key supporters (including the former president and the national co-chair), in which case it raises real questions about how well it might manage the government.  Don't get me wrong.  I read Larry Johnson's piece about Mrs. Clinton and I can absolutely accept everything he says.  She is incredibly bright, and people I know who know her say that she is personally very warm.  I have no doubt about her passion for issues that concern her, and I remember the brouhaha she caused with her apparently extemporaneous remarks at her own college graduation.  Despite the fears of some that she would hurt Democrats down-ballot in places in the South, until recently I did not think that would be the case:  in a general I think would compare quit favorably when on a stage with any of the Republicans.   And I think people underestimate her ability to get support from Republicans and independents.  But the recent missteps of her campaign's attacks against Obama have clearly alienated many in the Black community, and without passionate black support in the general she COULD hurt down-ballot candidates, and not just in the South.  I have never met the woman, do not think she is the devil incarnate, admire many of the things in her public career.   But I have been bothered and concerned about some of what has come out of her campaign recently, and even by some of her remarks.  

I note that Obama had a real chance to bash Mrs. Clinton, but passed.   When, in the debate, he was asked why he was using former Clinton foreign policy advisers and Hillary quipped about how he was going to explain that, he could have responded much more fiercely than his gentle remark about expecting her to advise him as well.   He could have said that these were people who knew her from her husband's presidency and still chose to support him, why might that be?  When he didn't hit back like that, Obama was acting consistently with his normal pattern of not seeking temporary advantage through a process that might damage feelings by belittling an opponent, recognizing that for long-term success you need to be able to come together on key issues despite previous disagreements.   It is something I admire about his public record.  It is also something that I though was somewhat undercut by some of his recent attacks upon Edwards, although I know it can be hard when (a) you are both competing to be the non-Hillary, and (b) there is a need to make contrasts between yourself and your opponents in order to give voters a reason to support you.  

One thing I like about Obama is that he has been following a 50-state strategy - he has put campaign resources into small and late states.  HE recognizes that he can thereby increase his financial support by having a visible presence, and he has thus already started to built an infrastructure that would not only be useful for him in the general but also for assisting down-ballot Democratic candidates.

I feel sorry for John Edwards.  He has brought as much passion to this race as I can remember seeing from a top-tier Democratic candidate, but e seems to be the Rodney Dangerfield of the cycle - he can't get no respect. People are finally recognizing that he might win Iowa, but even if he did, and comfortably, the follow-on meme has been how that would help Clinton and hurt Obama, not how he might benefit from it.  Of course, polling data does not show him doing well enough in NH or SC to capitalize even on a significant victory in Iowa, and of course the polls at this point are going to be completely accurate portrayals of what will happen, true?  And his decision to take public funds, rather than being portrayed as having any principle behind it, has been heavily criticized, including by the proprietor of Daily Kos.  People argue that it represents unilateral disarmament on his part that would cripple him even should he win the nomination.  Of course, when independent groups demonstrate how they can provide support for his principles and at least indirectly his candidacy he is bashed for not totally disavowing them, even though such independent groups could, along with party organizations, provide the kind of support necessary to offset the obscene amounts of money raised by the two candidates with which he is contending.

There are things I admire about all three top candidates.  I respect the intelligence with which Mrs. Clinton has applied herself to multiple issues during her Senate service.  She has demonstrated an ability to work across the aisle with Republicans on issues of national importance.  John Edwards willingness to be blunt about the problems facing many people is refreshing: he says things in a way that brings to the fore the concerns of those not often considered in our public dialog.  Obama displays consistently a recognition that we must find ways to get along with people with whom we disagree, and as one who tries to teach my students about learning how to disagree without being disagreeable his career is one I can use to illustrate that it is possible to be successful in politics without being unnecessarily mean and small-minded.

I have worries about each.  For me, as a Dean supporter, there were two things that marked the beginning of the end of his candidacy.  The first was when he appeared on Hardball with Chris Matthews and spoke about breaking up the concentration of power of the media.  I knew that was going to make him a target.  The second was the Gore endorsement, because it immediately placed all the other candidates at risk of being swamped and led to the formation of alliances and an almost common understanding that Dean had to be taken down in Iowa or it was all over.  I see applicability of a similar dynamic in this race, although not focused on one candidate.  Edwards represents a real threat to the way business has been done in Washington.  If he were able to win the nomination and the presidency by violating the 'conventional wisdom' of how a race has to be run this cycle, if he can so change the nature of how campaigns are done, that represent a threat to many:  the gatekeepers in the media, the conventional powerbrokers inside the Beltway, including lobbyists and Democratic party figures.  That seems to parallel something of the threat Dean posed.  

Similarly, there is a parallel on the focus of Iowa for both Obama and Clinton.  Should Clinton win Iowa, the conventional wisdom says it is hard to see how she would be stopped in NH and SC, and would probably run the table. Here I am not sure that it is the case.  If Edwards were effectively knocked out in Iowa by finishing 3rd, even if Clinton narrowly defeats Obama that does not knock him out, and in a two person race those who are uncomfortable with Clinton would quickly coalesce around Obama, making for a very unpredictable few weeks.  The press, which has no interest in the contest being over, would hype the race and magnify any differences no matter how minute between the two of them.   And under that kind of scrutiny it is impossible to predict which candidate might make a misstep and how such would play.

Should Obama win Iowa, there is a real possibility that he could catapult that victory to sweeping NH and SC.  I think that is a very real possibility.  But that would not eliminate Clinton because of the strong support she has built in the big states like CA.  There would be a lot of interest in how her people would react to losing the first three events.

And of course there is always the possibility of a split result.

All of that is speculation.  I cannot avoid it, because that is what I am reading, online and in the press, and seeing among talking heads.

I am encouraged that the Democratic contest has not yet gotten quite as nasty as the Republicans have been.  Although, as Faye Dunaway said to Robert Redford in Three Days of the Condor, when Redford's character noted that he had not tried to rape her, the night is still young.  It could get very nasty.  The kinds of bitterness we have seen in campaign diaries here could become far more common on the campaign trail.   And people will focus on missteps and misstatements.

I want to see a strong discussion of issues, even as Markos and Jerome have written that it is not issues that drive elections.  While I largely agree with the assessment they offered in CTG, I want to see some demonstration of how the candidates propose to lead us, what motivates their thinking, about what they are passionate.  

I have never had the desire to run for public office.  I have an ego, but it is not that big as to believe that I am the best choice for a particular office, although at times I have found myself voting for people  for offices I knew I could fill better than they would.  Each of these three has demonstrated a willingness to step into the fray, to take on the not very pleasant task of raising money, turning one's life over to constant public scrutiny and criticism, and attempting to persuade a sufficient number of those who will vote in Democratic primaries and caucuses to support them.  It is not an easy process.  And even as I find things to criticize or worry about with regards to all three, I admire all three for being willing to take on the challenge, to persist despite near constant criticism from one point or another of the 360 degrees around them.

All three are quality people.   In my opinion, all three would win the electoral college without too much difficulty against any of the top four Republicans, and possibly even more should a deadlocked GOP turn to someone like Newt Gingrich.   Perhaps because we can really taste victory for 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue our internal contest is so bitter.  

For me, I really hope to see a candidate who can thread a very small needle.   I accept the need to define the differences between oneself and one's opponent.  I acknowledge that one must demonstrate passion for certain issues, and to demonstrate why the American people should be willing to support you, first over other Democrats, and then over any Republican or third party (Mike Bloomberg?) candidate.   I hope that in the process of winning a preliminary battle the eventual nominee and his/her current opponents do not so damage one another that they lesson the possibilities of a meaningful victory in November.  I want someone who will be a fierce battler, like John Edwards.  I want someone who understands that the nature of our politics needs to change, to bring us all together for the common good, like Barack Obama.  I want someone whose intellectual curiosity leads to reading in depth and being able to go beyond the surface level of issues, looking ahead to consequences of actions, as Clinton demonstrated in the incident recounted yesterday b Larry Johnson.  

Most of all, I want to win.   I want a president who can heal this country, repair our image in the world, reestablish proper checks and balances among the branches, eliminate the depredation of our liberties we have undergone for the past 7 years, and give hope to the many who are beginning to despair, to think that nothing will be able to make a difference for them and their children.

I am not yet convinced by any of these three.   But I remain hopeful, perhaps foolishly so, that the process will give us a nominee in whom I cn believe, and not merely someone for whom I will vote merely because they are a Democrat and thus of necessity superior to the candidate from the other party.

I live in Virginia.  The last Democrat to carry my state was Lyndon Johnson.  I also want a Democratic nominee who will not abandon nor ignore this state, who thereby can help with continuing to bring this commonwealth back to political sanity.  That is possible for all three.  I would like to see all three commit to campaigning vigorously in parts of the country that too often the national democrats ignore.  

And I want the internal bitterness to be over.  

I don't want much for Christmas, do I?

Peace.  


Comments



May your every wish come true (jlmccreery - 12/24/2007 11:17:03 AM)
As a leaning toward Obama but open-minded fellow, I hope that there are many like you Teacher Ken. May all your wishes come true in a victorious, happy and prosperous New Year.

John in Japan



My feelings exactly... (Lowell - 12/24/2007 11:38:46 AM)
...except I can't write nearly as well as Teacherken.  Thanks! :)


Ditto (PM - 12/24/2007 12:05:09 PM)
Peace on earth and within the Party, because we want to party in late 2008.

And ditto on Teacherken's observations which are always thoughtful and well expressed.  It's nice to enjoy reading something.



I've brought up the Willie Horton example myself (Chris Guy - 12/24/2007 11:47:55 AM)
to these passionate yet at times holier-than-thou Democrats.

I might also remind everyone that this is the 4-year anniversary of people in the Dean campaign sending John Kerry a pair of flip-flops as a Christmas present.

Where's the first place Republicans should go to dig up dirt on the eventual Dem nominee? Drudge Report? RedState? Free Republic? Nope. Try DailyKos, MyDD, Open Left.

Heckuva job there "Democrats."



Agreed, and I hope (PM - 12/24/2007 12:15:17 PM)
the Democratic nominee is settled earlier rather than later because it will be more productive (and fun) turning our Google guns on the enemy.

aside: I think John McCain is enjoying a bump right now in part because he was sort of forgotten for a while as the GOP was going with the Baskins-Robbins approach (flavor of the month).    So, he has benefited in both GOP nominee polls and GOP-Dem match-up polls because he has been somewhat ignored.  



Our country needs a real change of heart so I support Barack Obama (Shawn - 12/24/2007 12:14:03 PM)

Happy Holidays to All!  



I like Obama a lot, but... (Lowell - 12/24/2007 12:37:21 PM)
...here are the questions I've been asking other Obama supporters, so far without good answers.

1. Does he have the foreign policy/national security experience we need at this point?
2. He speaks beautifully and powerfully, but what does he MEAN when he talks about "the audacity of hope" and "change the world?"  I mean, specifically -- what?
3. Is he willing to stand up and fight against out-of-control corporate power on our government and our laws?

Thanks.



Experience vs knowledge, however the knowledge is gained. (Tom Counts - 12/24/2007 1:20:04 PM)
First full disclosure: I've been an Edwards volunteer from the beginning and will continue to be.

Although I agree with some of the more thoughtful of the Obama supporters, I still believe that she gained a lot of actual knowledge and clear understanding of a wide spectrum of foreign affairs, what it means to be CINC, etc. And I don't have any big problem with the First Lady being very active in developing a preliminary plan for any major initiative and presenting her ideas as testimony before Congress. Clinton's first attempt at a plan certainly had serious flaws and probably never had a chance at serious debate in Congressional committees. But my basic point is that both the Congress and Clinton learned much from her failed first attempt.

Let's now jump to Edwards vs Obama for a moment to Obama's recent attack against Edwards with respect to the 527 issue. I think Edwards made valid points in his response. Possibly more importantly though is that I believe it is Obama, not Edwards, who is being hypocritical. The point I think is being overlooked is that Obama has been a U.S. Senator as long as Edwards had been at thhis point in the 2004 campaign, but yet so far as I have been able to determine Obama has offered no legislation that would tighten the rules for how 527s can attempt to influence voters. If Obama is really serious about the 527 issue, why has he not done something about it before now ?

Just some thoughts. I'd appreciate your comments.



Talk versus legislation (Todd Smyth - 12/24/2007 8:27:20 PM)
It is Edwards who has been waging war on special interest money while receiving a great deal of it. Obama responded to to his claim of fighting corporate abuse which Obama has actually passed legislation on including the Transparency and Accountability Act 2006 which opens up all gov spending.  He also passed the first campaign finance reform legislation in 25 years in Illinois and has been heavily involved in ethics legislation in both the Illinois and US Senate.


He is Absolutely Wrong About the Most Important Factor... (dsvabeachdems - 12/24/2007 4:56:20 PM)
in a child's education being the person standing in front of the classroom. It is the people who those children go home to and who provide the model for the majority of their lives. The shaping that will have the greatest influence on our children is us and long before that teacher is standing on the blame line before those children.

We need to come to grips with this. A teacher can make a significant difference but only with a student who comes to school prepared to learn.

And we need leadership that is willing to recognize and address this.

Sit with me some time and talk about sixth graders coming to school who have been sexually abused through the night or who sold sex in the housing area next door between the time they got dropped off and entered the school building. Or, who wear the scar of the hot iron pressed to the face by an angry mother when only four years old and who still lives in fear of more of the same. Or work as mules for their mothers in the drug trade.



the audacity of HOPE (Todd Smyth - 12/24/2007 8:15:09 PM)
I think you are talking about a much bigger problem related to poverty, despair and social injustice which are certainly not solved with better teachers.  However, poverty, despair and social injustice are all connected and caused by the same selfishness, arrogance, greed and indifference.  Whenever you get more and more people involved in the process of reaching outside of themselves to help other people, you reduce the amount of selfishness, arrogance, greed and indifference in the world and ultimately reduce poverty, despair and social injustice (also war) and fundamentally change the world for the better.  And that is the audacity of HOPE.


Audacity is leading... (dsvabeachdems - 12/24/2007 9:15:56 PM)
holding ourselves to account and not dissembling issues. The fact that injustice exists does not relieve anyone from responsibility for their actions. It should mitigate our judgment of others' failures but never excuse them.

This particular panacea is unfortunate and unfair. It does nothing to end the selfishness, arrogance, greed and indifference shown toward these unfortunate children. And it offers teachers as the sacrificial lambs for those failures.  



I like Obama a lot, but... (Todd Smyth - 12/24/2007 7:29:09 PM)
1. Does he have the foreign policy/national security experience we need at this point?

He was the only one of the top 3 Dem candidates who not only opposed the Iraq war before it started but explained why it was a mistake.  How it would inflame the Muslim world against the US, strengthen the recruiting arm of Al Queda and make us less safe.  The other two voted for the war in Iraq, Hillary with "conviction" supported the resolution to use force in Iraq.

The Lugar-Obama Act to detect and secure weapons of mass destruction
http://globalsolutions.org/in_...

2. He speaks beautifully and powerfully, but what does he MEAN when he talks about "the audacity of hope" and "change the world?"  I mean, specifically -- what?

Hope is the only thing that has ever changed the world. Hope ended the Great Depression, both world wars and prevented nuclear war during the Cuban Missile Crisis.  Corny but true. (read his book)

3. Is he willing to stand up and fight against out-of-control corporate power on our government and our laws?

He is the only one of the top 3 Dem candidates who ever has passed legislation to fight corrupt corporate power.

Barack Obama worked with US Sen. Tom Coburn to pass the Federal Funding Accountability and Transparency Act of 2006, which requires public access to all government spending (earmarks, grants, loans and contracts) to help fix the fraud, waste and abuse in our government and make it much more difficult to "wire" contracts.  Goes into effect January 1, 2008 and you can track the spending at: USAspending.gov

Federal Funding Accountability and Transparency Act of 2006 - Obama/Coburn
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F...
of2006

1998 Illinois State Gift Ban Act "Heralded As the Most Sweeping Good-Government Legislation in Decades" which "Revolutionized" Illinois Politics.
http://www.barackobama.com/fac...
hp  



Broken links sorry (Todd Smyth - 12/24/2007 8:30:37 PM)
Federal Funding Accountability and Transparency Act of 2006 - Obama/Coburn
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F...

1998 Illinois State Gift Ban Act "Heralded As the Most Sweeping Good-Government Legislation in Decades" which "Revolutionized" Illinois Politics.
http://www.barackobama.com/fac...  



Barack Obama Is The One (Lee Diamond - 12/24/2007 9:04:07 PM)
I think that Obama has answered Lowell's questions, but I'd be pleased to address the questions in a few days.

On the education issue,  it seems that our friend posting here did not watch the speech that Shawn posted because Obama addressed both sides of the issue.  That is, he addressed the role of educators and the even more critical role of parents.  He talked about the same things he raised in his 2004 convention speech: the need to focus on excellence, turn off the TV, etc.

I haven't looked into it, but I will be shocked if Obama does not support raises for teachers so that they are compensated in accordance with the role they play in any decent society.

Our friend from Va Beach who posted about education brings up some of the most extreme examples of wounded children.  It is important that we attend to their needs, but we should not expect presidential candidates to address those issues in a standard stump speech.  As president, I firmly believe that Barack Obama will be dedicated to all children and their future.

I think that Barack Obama is an extraordinary person and a thrilling, most amazing presidential candidate.  We cannot afford to miss the opportunity represented by Obama's candidacy for president of the United States of America.



This is not about Obama as a candidate (dsvabeachdems - 12/24/2007 9:37:39 PM)
It's about a wrong headed concept.

You will find that barely adequate teachers have students that excel where the students' families value education. And very good teachers fail where students' families are otherwise distracted.

You will find students in school houses with dirt floors hanging onto every word that the teacher speaks. And students in high schools with cutting edge technology that are plotting the demise of fellow students.

We can throw money at the problem till the cows come home, but our social ills are not going to be solved by teachers; bless all of them.

May the next President deliver leadership.



Obama On Education (Lee Diamond - 12/24/2007 10:42:54 PM)
I hate to be a dead horse my friend, but watch the speech Shawn posted on this series of responses to Teacher Ken.  He said (precisely), I can go into the schools and talk to these kids, tell them how I overcame my problems etc.  Clearly ,, a guy like that is going to take the Dept of Education by the neck and make them do the right thing by our children.  Someone committed to children can do no less.

BTW, Frankly,  Edwards cannot even hope to compare his background on public policy to Obama's.



I saw the horse twitch (dsvabeachdems - 12/24/2007 11:30:39 PM)
We are closer to agreement than you may believe. Though we have never met, I do consider you a friend and compadre.

A couple of viewings still leaves one with that lingering phrase "...the most important factor in a child's education is the person standing in front of the classroom." The other fluff is there, but teachers are on the blame line.

One must also be perplexed that he notes South Carolina's as the highest drop out rate in the nation. But he doesn't take South Carolina to task for reporting a percentage 28 points above the figure he relies upon for this statement. Being in denial doesn't help overcome a problem. Shame on South Carolina.

We have issues that require straight-forward appraisal and honest discussion.

What is most repulsive is an uninformed electorate and the thought of a permanent underclass developing in our nation.



And to be absolutely clear (dsvabeachdems - 12/24/2007 11:33:59 PM)
I am carrying no other candidate's water here.


Hi dsvabeachdems - Cool (Lee Diamond - 12/25/2007 3:42:53 PM)
I'll confess:  You seem to know more about education than I do.  I don't know the specifics you cited about South Carolina.  Obama listens and Obama doing his best is going to bring high quality results for the United States of America.

The reason I mentioned Edwards is people seem to think he is an alternative to Clinton.  He isn't.  He is a well intentioned guy, but lacks Obama's substance and 20+ year commitment to public service.