No PAC Money Please

By: samrasoul
Published On: 10/2/2007 10:01:24 PM

With the help of concerned Virginians, I am able to campaign for Congress, as a Democrat, to represent the 6th Congressional District of Virginia (www.SAM2008.com).  Fourteen members of Congress have said they do not take any money from PACs. And I have decided to join them.

First, let me explain what PAC means:
A PAC is defined as a group that raises and spends limited "hard" money contributions for the specific purpose of electing or defeating candidates. Organizations that raise soft money for issue advocacy may also set up a PAC. A PAC can contribute $5,000 to a candidate per election, and up to $15,000 a year to a national political party. PACs may receive up to $5,000 each from individuals, other PACs and party committees per year.

Let me say that giving money to political campaigns may be good.  If you make that choice for yourself, rather than a PAC, I very much hope you will decide to contribute to my campaign.  So what is the problem?
Well, the problem is that money from PACs has become a pervasive, disruptive, and even corrosive force in Washington.  Excess is the problem.  There are many things in the life of individuals, organizations, and communities that are harmless, perhaps even wholesome, in and of themselves.  But there is nothing that can not be carried to excess and/or misused.  And that is where we are with PAC contributions today because they are the method used by groups with unwholesome intentions.

Every PAC contribution comes with assurances it is intended for better government.  And some of our finest legislators, from both parties, are among the happy recipients.  But we now have a long experience of decisions taken in Washington that prove to be absurd and/or probably the result of corruption.  Thus, I believe that it will be best if I am free to represent you in Congress after consultation primarily with you, my 6th District voters.  Of course, there will be input from other sources, but not from those who routinely pay and then want to play.


Comments



Systematic Problem (code - 10/3/2007 10:30:49 AM)
I applaud your resolve to not take PAC money. I want to qualify three important issues here, though: 1) Not all PACs are bad, 2) The good ones get a bad rap from the bad ones, and 3) the government forces some groups into PAC status unnecessarily.

It should be noted that this very forum is run and paid for by Raising Kaine PAC, which does raise money on behalf of candidates, but which, I believe in this cycle, has not given directly to candidates, instead having raised via ActBlue. Also, the YouRoots community (button on the right) is a partner PAC of Raising Kaine's - DEMPAC, which also gives no money to candidates but instead recruits volunteers for them.

In both cases, because they advocate for political issues, these two groups, both doing good things in Virginia, and not attempting in any way to sway candidates through money or influence, are forced into the PAC moniker by the IRS and Virginia and federal law. Partly it's because of campaign finance, but also it's because a PAC is an easy-to-start entity that doesn't require the jumping-through-hoops and restrictive rules of setting up a non-profit (a PAC is still technically a tax-exempt entity).

Perhaps this represents a systematic flaw in the way political advocacy groups are forced to organize in the US.

Regardless, I applaud your decision not to take direct PAC money, and wish other candidates would do the same.



Actually, the RK PAC gave money (Lowell - 10/3/2007 10:32:47 AM)
to its endorsed candidates in the primary.  Was that so wrong? :)


My Bad (code - 10/3/2007 2:25:04 PM)
Well, there you go.


Key words: systematic flaw (samrasoul - 10/3/2007 10:49:01 AM)
PACs are not inherently bad by nature, nor are most PACs intent on committing malice. 

In fact, just as I believe most workers have should have the right to come together to fight for acceptable conditions (unionize), like-minded individuals should have the right to come together in unision and push for initiatives they believe in (democracy). 

But if you refer back to my piece, I state the problem being is excess.  This means that the political system must be flawed in how we bring our leaders to power.

ONLY when we stop electing the best fundraisers, and start electing the best people, will the dignity of our republic be restored.



I've never really understood this issue. (Lowell - 10/3/2007 12:51:27 PM)
Why is a PAC -- let's say for environmental issues -- any worse than an individual -- let's say a rich oil executive?  Is the issue PACs per se or the entire campaign finance system?  But if we went to public financing, wouldn't that mean we'd have to support fringe, extreme candidates with taxpayer dollars? 


Not Taking PAC Money Was Andy Hurst's Biggest Mistake (Not Harry F. Byrd, Sr. - 10/3/2007 12:17:05 PM)
It totally hamstrung his ability to get his message out.

You should reconsider or your are wasting your time if you are out to win.



Nobody cares where your money comes from... (The Grey Havens - 10/3/2007 2:06:48 PM)
If they did, Hillary wouldn't be leading the Dems and there'd never be a Republican elected to office in America.

Until the game changes, you get the money so you can get the message out.  The only way the source of your money is a problem is if your donors are indicted (maybe) or convicted, or if the other guy takes enough money so that he/she can make a big enough deal out of your donors to hurt you at the polls.

This really was Andy's 'Achilles Heel" last year, and I'd have rather had Andy in office with ten million dollars of Wal-Mart /halliburton/exxon money than Tom Davis who's as dirty as they come.

It's not a sign of integrity to give up PAC money, it's a sign you're not willing to face the hard reality of American politics.

We need to get enough people elected to change the system, but they have to GET ELECTED.



A Difficult Balance. (samrasoul - 10/3/2007 3:53:56 PM)
As I specifically stated previously, I do not believe that candidates that take money from PACs are bad people.  I personally do not want to take donations from PACs because I would not like funds coming to me in a bundled sum on behalf a group of people.  I encourage PACs that favor our campaign to ask PAC members to donate directly.

I am a progressive who wants change and I want to change the system from within by pushing the limits, but the lines must be drawn somewhere. 

A political system that is highly dependent on 30 second commercials is flawed.  I am not a candidate who is going to whine about it, but WIN the olde fashion way, one person at a time.  My congressional campaign will be a nearly two year campaign.  Over the past 8 months we have been to over 200 events around our region listening to tens of thousands of views and dreams so we can carry those with us in our battle for better government.

Idealistic, you can call it that, but more candidates need to stand up and say I will not tip-toe around morality.  Quality leadership is the fundamental problem we have in America, and those that disagree should ask themselves why did 60% of eligible Virginia voters NOT vote in 2005. 

We need to stop trying to cater to the minority of people that do vote, and start trying to do what is best for all Americans.  By believing in this message, the people will reward you with the honor of serving them.



The thing is, what's the difference if I give you money (Lowell - 10/3/2007 4:49:02 PM)
individually or through the Raising Kaine PAC?  It's still money going to your candidacy.  It's still from me.  I've just given it to another entity first.  Is the real issue you're getting at the distorting and corrupting influence of huge corporate money in politics?  If so, I'd just say that it seems every time we try to fix campaign financing, we make it worse.  On the other hand, the internet now allows for millions of people to easily and quickly give small amounts of money, $25 or $50, perhaps lessening the influence of the corporations and other special interests.  Ideally, if millions of citizens gave relatively small amounts of money, the candidates wouldn't be beholden to anyone in particular.  On the other hand, I've seen the influence that even a $500 or $1,000 contribution can have on a candidate, especially in local races.  I'm not sure what you can do about that and stay within the 1st Amendment.


There's different kinds of PAC's (code - 10/3/2007 4:47:15 PM)
You seem to imply that PAC culture is leading to the 30-second-TV-spot culture. Not trying to argue that point, but I think it's *very* important to make a distinction between different types of PAC's. The PAC's which you are blaming for the current culture, and I'm not arguing that you're wrong (you may very well be right), are Federal IRS 527's, like MoveOn and Swiftboat.

There are a *ton* of different PAC setups, every local committee, and the state party itself, are technically PAC's. So I think it's really important to qualify this conversation. If you're lambasting Federal, soft-money 527's, I'm with you 100%. If you're making blanket statements about all PAC's, including state ones like Raising Kaine, then I'm more inclined to agree with Lowell and GH that you're giving up good money and making arbitrary distinctions.



From Before... (samrasoul - 10/3/2007 5:12:30 PM)
PACs are not inherently bad by nature, nor are most PACs intent on committing malice. 
In fact, just as I believe most workers have should have the right to come together to fight for acceptable conditions (unionize), like-minded individuals should have the right to come together in unision and push for initiatives they believe in (democracy). 

But if you refer back to my piece, I state the problem being is excess.  This means that the political system must be flawed in how we bring our leaders to power.

ONLY when we stop electing the best fundraisers, and start electing the best people, will the dignity of our republic be restored.



I agree with your intentions, but... (Lowell - 10/3/2007 5:16:56 PM)
...I'm not sure about the details here.  For starters, how do you define "excess?"  Is it like pornography, you know it when you see it?  Ha.


For Example... (samrasoul - 10/3/2007 5:25:45 PM)
For example, nearly 50% of the contributions to the 6th district incumbent were given from PACs.  This is an aweful lot of time that needs to be dedicated to those interests. 

No condemnation is offered here, just an explanation of my choice.  Though I do hope others will join in steps towards reforming how we bring our leaders to power.



So, if he spent his time soliciting donations (Lowell - 10/3/2007 5:39:40 PM)
from individuals, that would take less time?  I'm not sure I see how that is the case...


Public Funds (samrasoul - 10/3/2007 5:49:24 PM)
I know you are not a fan of public financing (as I think you stated earlier)for federal elections, but I am.  It is hard for me to defend soliciting donations from anyone, since I believe that the time spent soliciting on donations takes away from the real focus...what is best for America.

This is where I have drawn my battle line, I happily accept donations from individuals knowing that I must raise the needed money to get elected and be a voice of change in the system.



That wasn't my question, though. (Lowell - 10/3/2007 5:53:03 PM)
What I'm asking is whether it would take less time to solicit money from individuals than from PACs.  Thanks.


Im no expert, (samrasoul - 10/3/2007 6:02:53 PM)
but I would imagine it would take less time to solicit from a PAC.  But a PAC can only donate about twice that of a person, unless that PAC has ties to 5, 10, 20 other PACs...but that is back to my problem with the money from PACs. 

I would much rather be listening to views of each citizen of my district (solicitation), than pandering to every crowd with $5k for me that expects a certain level of influence on my voting. 



Uncle Sam (Gordie - 10/4/2007 6:59:16 AM)
as I know you from the Buena Vista, Labor Day parade, let me add my 2 cents.

As you say you are not an expert. Well wht don't you become an expert by taking PAC money and get a real sense of the inside of PAC money.

When elected to congress how could you stand on the floor of the house and agrue against something you know little about.

Get the experience then change PAC's for the betterment of the system.



Rationalization. (samrasoul - 10/4/2007 8:02:59 AM)
For me, that is a rationalization.  I could apply that same frame of thinking to every lobbyist and special interest.

I just don't see why I would have to take their funds to learn about them.  I'll try reading.



How exactly (UVAHoo - 10/3/2007 4:54:24 PM)
is taking $5K from a PAC (ie - a group of individuals donors who have pooled their resources and support a certain issue or issues) different from taking $4.6K (the limit an individual can give federally this cycle) from one person? 

Refusing to take money from PACs is an empty gesture - will you also refuse to take individual contributions from several members of the same PAC?  Would you refuse to take the maximum contribution from a wealthy individual?



Bundled (samrasoul - 10/3/2007 5:16:35 PM)
In my humble opinion about this tricky subject, I do not believe that funds bundled together given to campaigns, are in the best interest of our nation.  The key word I used was excess...the system places too much power in the hands lobbyists and fundraising dollars. 

From before:  Idealistic, you can call it that, but more candidates need to stand up and say I will not tip-toe around morality.  Quality leadership is the fundamental problem we have in America, and those that disagree should ask themselves why did 60% of eligible Virginia voters NOT vote in 2005. 

We need to stop trying to cater to the minority of people that do vote, and start trying to do what is best for all Americans.  By believing in this message, the people will reward you with the honor of serving them.



You didn't really answer my question (UVAHoo - 10/3/2007 5:34:29 PM)
Would you refuse the maximum donation from an individual?  How do you decide what "excess" is?  What if you got a bunch of contributions from lawyers or insurance agents or farmers.  How many would you have to receive from the industry for it to reach a level of "excess" that you wouldn't accept?

I understand the sentiment behind wanting to reduce the influence of money in politics but I don't understand the practical application.



I will keep trying (samrasoul - 10/3/2007 5:55:23 PM)
I do not like NOT answering a question, sorry.  I'll keep trying till I get it right.

I would not refuse the maximum donation from an individual.  Excess is certainly subjective, but for a presidential candidate to have to raise twice as much in the 2008 cycle as in the 2004 cycle to be competitive, our system has gone terribly wrong.

I refer back to something I just wrote to Lowell:
I know you are not a fan of public financing (as I think you stated earlier)for federal elections, but I am.  It is hard for me to defend soliciting donations from anyone, since I believe that the time spent soliciting on donations takes away from the real focus...what is best for America.

This is where I have drawn my battle line, I happily accept donations from individuals knowing that I must raise the needed money to get elected and be a voice of change in the system.



Much of the money is coming from small, online (Lowell - 10/3/2007 5:58:54 PM)
contributions.  I believe Hillary Clinton alone raised $8 million online last quarter.  Personally, I think that this is a great thing.  What about you?  Thanks.


It is different (Afton Dem - 10/3/2007 5:59:30 PM)
Taking $4,600 from an individual -- you know the money is from that individual.  When you take $5,000 from a PAC, you don't know where the funds derive.  Sometimes its individuals, sometimes organizations, sometimes other PACs. 

People give money to candidates for lots of different reasons, which they may make clear or not.  PACs are formed for one purpose -- to influence legislation through the funneling of funds into politics.  Of course there's a difference.



But the influence is the same (UVAHoo - 10/3/2007 6:26:34 PM)
An individual who gives $4600 is going to have access to the elected and therefore influence. 

People and PACs give money because they want to elect someone who is going to vote the way they want.  It may be on one issue or it may be on a range of issues but the end goal is the same.



Not necessarily true (Afton Dem - 10/3/2007 6:53:48 PM)
People give money for an infinite number of reasons.  It could be a relative, a dear friend, someone who hates the other guy, a Dem who gives to all Dems, etc.  And you know who is responsible for it, can tell them yes or no, etc. 

PACs are formed for one reason.  To put MORE money in a specific and targeted manner to get a result on a cause or bill.  They're designed to avoid limits on contributions, and get more money into the hands of candidates.  They are an incumbent's dream, a challenger's nightmare.  Any guess how much PAC money goes to incumbents percentage-wise?



Also, Sam's point was about excess, yes? (UVAHoo - 10/3/2007 6:27:56 PM)
If $5000 is excessive, why isn't $4600?

How is an individual who gives $4600 to twenty different candidates any less insidious than a PAC that does the same thing?



It might be, or might not be (Afton Dem - 10/3/2007 6:57:47 PM)
Who knows?  An individual could be insidious, just rich and stupid, etc.

But with a PAC, you do know.  Its very nature is to influence legislation by giving money.  Why is that ever a good thing?  We accept it because we're used to it, and and have become immune in this modern age.  Reading about the "money race" in the Washington Post is disgusting, and makes you realize how our electoral system is fast becoming a farce.  It didn't used to be this way, and doesn't have to be know. 



A dose of reality for those criticizing Sam for taking this stand (Afton Dem - 10/3/2007 5:55:52 PM)
How much PAC money do you think Sam is passing up?  Does anyone seriously believe that there are hordes of committees lined up to contribute to a first-time candidate against a long-term, entrenched incumbent?  Even Judy Feder, who worked PACs like there was no tomorrow and had the DCCC pushing for her, didn't get into six figures from PACs. 


Government Corruption (samrasoul - 10/3/2007 6:13:16 PM)
I really enjoy the dialog, even though we may disagree.  This is democracy.

But I want to bring to the forefront that corruption in our government is the largest single issue, and this has become so much worse in the past two decades.  Not Iraq, healthcare, nor even educating our children trumps the issue of our withering republic. 

We can rationalize all we want, but in our gut we know that decades from now, our nation will face great peril if we do not take a stand now. 

We can never rid the government completely of corruption, but we can tip the scales back in the favor of good and progress.  This is why we are democrats and this is why I want to serve you.



Thanks Sam, I respect your views on this (Lowell - 10/3/2007 7:29:16 PM)
subject even if I don't fully agree with you.  I also greatly respect your willingness to engage in a dialogue with members of the RK community, myself included. Finally, I am very happy that you're running against a right-wing Republican who more than deserves to be replaced next November. Thanks! 


Beauty of Blogs (samrasoul - 10/3/2007 8:04:35 PM)
This is the great thing about the blogosphere, we (those with access to the internet) all have the opportunity to have equal weight with our viewpoints.  More importantly, information flows in both directions.  Thank you for all you do in promoting progressive ideas in Virginia.


Connie Brennan's mailer (Kathy Gerber - 10/3/2007 11:16:54 PM)
I don't have a copy on hand nor do I remember the wording, but in a recent mailer Connie Brennan sent something like "The New Rules."

1. I will not accept gifts from lobbyists.
...
5. I will not put lobbyists' interests above yours.

It was so simple and to the point: she's not for sale.  So PAC money or not, she makes a direct and pointed pledge that gets to the issue.

If I get another copy, I'll get the exact wording of all the points.  Frankly, it's the best mailer I've ever seen.



That is great and to the point! (samrasoul - 10/3/2007 11:29:37 PM)


This Democrat Ain't Got Good Sense (Galenbrux - 10/4/2007 5:30:12 PM)
This guy ain't got sense enough to be a good political candidate. He is a Democrat, which means he is already behind the eightball when it comes to fund raising. So, he makes it worse by declaring that he won't take money from PACs. HE VOLUNTARILY HANDICAPS HIMSELF FURTHER.

It has already been mentioned that all PACs are not bad. Some PACs are very good friends of good Democrats.

Besides, the point is that PACs aren't the problem; corrupt politicians are the problems. That is, politicians who take PAC money and in return do the PAC's dirty deeds.

Is Ransoul really saying that he can be corrupted by PAC money?
I think Ransoul means that PAC money has corrupted too many other politicians and that he does not want to be tainted by the bad reputation that comes along with PAC money.

Lastly, who is Ransoul trying to impress with this tactic? Which voter group? It seems that he will not gain votes from right wingers and Republicans, and he probably has the liberals behind him already. After all, only liberals are worried about the influence of PAC money.

This is a poor start for Mr. Ransoul. He should rethink his position, and hope that this announcement fades away. Oh, check out the trial lawyers's PAC, as a prospect for a nice contribution.



It's Rasoul (samrasoul - 10/5/2007 1:30:12 PM)
Thank you for your comments. I don't believe corrupt politicians is the core problem, I believe we have a system of that does not protect the American people from electing poor leadership.  A major reason for this is bundled fundraising dollars that lobbyists represent, often in the form of many PACs.


Some of us are missing a key point about PACs (Glant - 10/5/2007 1:26:36 AM)
I think that one of the problems with PACs that I did not see discussed earlier (but I may have missed it) is that they are designed in some cases to help people get around the contribution limits to individual campaigns.

As Sam said "A PAC can contribute $5,000 to a candidate per election, and up to $15,000 a year to a national political party. PACs may receive up to $5,000 each from individuals ..."

What he should have gone on to say is that each individual can contribute to multiple PACS, and that each PAC can caontribute to the same candidate.  So that if I were a big rich lobbyist (I am not) who wanted to support one specific candidate for the House of Representatives, I could first donate my personal $4600 maximum, then I could form a PAC and donate $5000 to the PAC and have the PAC donate that money to the same candidate, then I could find other PACS interested in supporting the same candidate and donate money to these new PACS.  In the end, I may have donated indirectly many times the federal limit.



Right on the ball! (samrasoul - 10/5/2007 1:33:25 PM)
I'm glad you understand the vices of the system currently in place.